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Defending Dart read with RPO


morris
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We ran the play when I coached MS so I know teams can run it. I’m looking at using the KB on the HS level and teams can definitely run it. I think the true can also be true of counter GT with the RPO on the backside.

Formation 2x2 spread
Play: Dart playside typically blocks ISO. Some teams will have the PST pass set. Backside T wraps play side as the lead blocker for the RB. QB reads EMLOS for keep or pull. The two BS WRs run some version of fast screen.

Now my understanding is the two OLB are over the slots. Mike reads the C and then would follow the pulling tackle. BS DE sees the BST pull so he follows him giving the QB a pull read. That leaves only the backside safety for the QB.

Am I missing something?


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morris
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Is Dart and Counter Trey with the QB reading the DE a play the KB just doesn’t defend?


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DumCoach
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You don't have to have Mike follow a pulling tackle.  He's actually looking for guards.  So, if TG both pull, then QB gets a pull read. 

"Football is for the kids - But let's win anyway."


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morris
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So the answer is to have the Mine take the QB on Dart and Counter GT because the DE is following the tackle?


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DumCoach
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So the answer is to have the Mine take the QB on Dart and Counter GT because the DE is following the tackle?

That's what I described however at the HS level you have three more front calls:

On/On
On/Off
Off/On
Off/Off

The cues instruct the DT's from left to right.  So "Off/On" tells the left DT to play off the LOS and the right DT to play on the LOS.  The DE's do the opposite of the guard to their side.  "Off/On" will result in the "Alabama" stunt and "On/Off" results in "Arizona".

The manual for youth uses "On/On" which means both guards are crowding the LOS. It tells Mike his assignment for following pulling guards is "On".  On/On puts both DE's in "Off".

If you call "Off/Off" the DT's will flex 18" off LOS and key the guard opposite.  If he pulls, they pull (The center will miss his back block on the flexed DT.).  It's in my DC Pro 4-3. The DE's do the opposite of the DT's or crowd the LOS and not pull with the OT's.  Mike's assignment is now "Off" for watching pulling guards.  The "Off/Off" call was specifically designed to defend the Trap.  "On/On" was designed to defend "Tunnel Screen".

Modify Mike's assignment as needed.

"Football is for the kids - But let's win anyway."


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morris
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Putting the DT off helps with GT read but not with Dart. It sounds like it would prevent the DE from giving a keep read on Dart though. I’m coaching on the HS level now and the best team we play runs GT, Dart, 1 back power, IZ, OZ and a few other things. With most of the offenses we face the KB appears to hold up. This offense presents a number of issues it appears. They even pull the center instead of the G on certain looks.


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DumCoach
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Putting the DT off helps with GT read but not with Dart. It sounds like it would prevent the DE from giving a keep read on Dart though.

Agreed.  Not with the dart. 

But if QB is reading the DE and DE follows the OT, then QB gets a "Keep" read and runs weak.  What keeps Mike, if keying QB when center doesn't block back, from tackling the QB?  The zone blocking is trying to keep him from going strong with C/G. 

Granted, it's a good play but I always like to start with the QB having a known read.  We know he's keeping. 

The base play already has a problem because PST has to deal with a flexed "5" tech DE who will fight inside of his base block.

I have not seen this play before so I'm not familiar with how it's defended.  Are there any websites that show defending it?

I assume the slot to pulling OT's side is running an out route?  Drawing OLB with him?

"Football is for the kids - But let's win anyway."


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DumCoach
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So what happens if the free safety reads the OT as he kills the bee and blitzes QB if he pulls?

"Football is for the kids - But let's win anyway."


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morris
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So what happens if the free safety reads the OT as he kills the bee and blitzes QB if he pulls?

He better tackle him or it’s not going to be good lol.

The Center against the KB might not block play side but not always.  Our blocking rules had the center block away from the play side.

Our rules (other people block it different) were
BSG: B gap if we got something strange like a 0 and an A Gap threat we would gap it.
C: MoMa
PSG: 1 on the LOS from the starting from a 0 tech out
PST: 2 on the LOS
BST: pull and wrap through first daylight

We could add a TE to or away from the play side.

We ran it out of 2x2 and 3x1. The WR would get a signal so they could run different combinations. Fast screens were the norm but we had other combos too. I didn’t run into issues on the MS level. On the HS level if my PST had issues with the DE he would pass set to get him to run upfield.

One of our opponents mayors in this play. Some just call it tackle wrap.


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