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BigKDB2
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Is there anything someone can suggest?? We've tried everything....or so it seems....


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jrk5150
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Have you tried the Wyatt end over end snap?  I have found that to be MUCH more secure than the traditional twist as you go back snap.


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BigKDB2
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That's what we started with....may go back to it. We have a new center. Maybe alot is just repetition?? Just getting frustrated.


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CoachJJ
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Make sure the QB is under there right ... we have the Center sit down on his hands and force the QB to 'lift' the Center up to where he belongs ... this ensures the QB is in there tight and ensures the Center knows exactly where those hands are ... in my experience this is the first place where problems come from with younger kids ... inconsistent hand placement ...

Coach JJ
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"Football may be the best-taught subject in American High Schools because it may be the only subject that we haven't tried to make easy."

~Dorothy Farnan
  Former English Department Chairman
  Erasmus Hall High School - Brooklyn, New York


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patriotsfatboy1
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Make sure the QB is under there right ... we have the Center sit down on his hands and force the QB to 'lift' the Center up to where he belongs ... this ensures the QB is in there tight and ensures the Center knows exactly where those hands are ... in my experience this is the first place where problems come from with younger kids ... inconsistent hand placement ...

This is #1.  Many kids don't get their hands in there as they are afraid of touching another boy.  I have gone down on the ground and watched exactly what they were doing and made adjustments accordingly.  Get in there and see what is happening. 


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gumby_in_co
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A lot of these problems are caused by the QB leaving early, especially in the DW where you're asking your QB to do an awful lot after the snap. Something that has always helped are the 3 "P's".

Press
Push
Pull

Press your hands up and forward into the Center's neither regions.
Push your hands forward when you say "HIT!" (stops him from backing out too soon).
Pull the ball into your crotch, point first.

When in doot . . . glass and oot.


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bignose
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I need a few more details, you may have to kneel behind the center and QB to try to observe what is happening

Fumbled snaps possible causes:

QB pulling out too fast
Are the QB's hands in far  enough (knuckle of middle finger on the "brown" spot) ?
Or are his hands in too far? ( we once had a QB put his hands all the way in front of the Center's males parts, he reached in that far! When he spread his fingers, he was covering the laces on the Center's pants!) Our Center was a shy sophomore who didn't know any better! He just kept hitting himself in the dick with the ball.

QB's hands separating as the ball comes up. I do not like to cross thumbs, some coaches do. I like to fit the tip of the bottom thumb in the hollow of the top thumb and press up with the bottom hand
QB not extending his arms and riding the Center as he steps-are the QB's arms slightly flexed or straight?

Check QB's stance, is he bent over and reaching forward for the ball? He needs to bend his knees and scoot in closer.
QB swinging the ball out and not seating it-with the DW he has to get that ball tucked away so that the pulling guard doesn't strike it as he pulls.

Is the Center "throwing " the ball up, instead of placing it in the QB's hand
Center not bringing the ball all the way up to the QB's top hand-if he is hitting the bottom hand the QB never gets a grip
Center missing the "target"

If worse comes to worse, you can always go to the two handed end over end snap, although from personal experience, I do like to resort to this, but you can't start the play if you don't have the ball!

You rush a miracle man, you get rotten miracles!


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angalton
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Make sure the QB is under there right ... we have the Center sit down on his hands and force the QB to 'lift' the Center up to where he belongs ... this ensures the QB is in there tight and ensures the Center knows exactly where those hands are ... in my experience this is the first place where problems come from with younger kids ... inconsistent hand placement ...

Thank you

The greatest accomplishment is not in never failing, but in rising again after you fail.


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Bob Goodman
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This is #1.  Many kids don't get their hands in there as they are afraid of touching another boy.

Or a girl!

Bignose's diagnostics are good.  You need to see how the ball is getting away.  For those who use a wrists-together method for the QB, the commonest fault is for the QB to not keep them together until he feels the ball.  In that case, the ball most often squirts thru the QB's hands.  If the ball winds up behind the QB's hands, this is probably the fault.  If the ball winds up in front of his hands, it's because he's not sticking them far enough under to begin w or is pulling out too soon.

Sometimes the fault is the failure of the snapper to get the ball back far enough, or, more commonly, high enough.

OK, so you've diagnosed the problem by looking closely & correcting them.  Then the problem is to get your snapper & QB to remember the correct form when they also have to think about the other details of the play.  One reason I prefer sidesaddle is that it's more forgiving that way.  However, for a straight-ahead-facing QB, the next best IMO is the overlapping thumbs (eagle wings) and snapping the ball point-on.  That can be done with the snapper either sliding the point straight back or turning the ball over point-for point.


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parone
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if all else fails, new qb.  we had a boy that simply wouldn't put his hands in correctly.  he was smart, fast and tough.  would have been a perfect qb.  but he fumbled about 1 out of 3 snaps.  i'd lay on the ground, put his hands correctly, he'd get two right.  fumble the next.  said he 'felt funny' about putting his hands up against the center.

it actually worked out.  after losing in OT in our first game due to, i believe it was 11 fumbled snaps, of which we lost 4, we installed the single wing in 2 practices and went 5-1 the rest of the way. 

if that young man had learned to take an under center snap, i'd never have become an UBSWinger.  I guess i owe him.

Dream Big.  Work Hard. Stay Humble.


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CD Rams Coach M
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Is your center bringing the ball straight back, or are you asking him to turn the ball?


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Bob Goodman
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Also be aware that there are lots of refinements of snapper-QB exchange.  (I found this to be true even in sidesaddle.)  So for instance, even if you have the QB's wrists together, the dihedral isn't necessarily straight up & down or left & right.  It can be uncomfortable for the non-dominant wrist to twist & hold the bottom position in the up-&-down, so some teach an angle to the horizontal; just make sure the snapper adjusts his turn of the ball to match.

Of the various types other than sidesaddle, I think overlapping thumbs by the QB over the ball, along w 2-hand end-over-end by the snapper, is the surest combination.  The snapper (told to try to hit his own butt with it, not his crotch) that way has both hands on the bottom of the ball at the instant the QB has both hands on top of it.  2-handed snapping does sacrifice a snapper's hand that he could otherwise use for either balance or fending off an opponent, so there's no free lunch.


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Coach CP2
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I've found that making the QB lock his thumbs is one of the easiest adjustments that makes a big difference.  My exchange issues almost completely went away after doing this. 


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DoubleWingCoach
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Yeah we JUST dealt with this exact thing!!!!!

Ended up changing centers to the kid who was our C last year and he's a master of the two handed snap (the wyatt end over end snap).... The two handed snap is faster as well, which means your plays hit faster.  The longer it takes for your QB to get the ball can have a definite impact on how well your plays go as the defense is coming as soon as that ball moves...


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BigKDB2
(@bigkdb2)
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Coach JJ....your suggestion solved our issue last night!! After we instructed our QB, we fumbled twice outta maybe 30 to 40 plays. Hopefully will continue tonight!!


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