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Prodigy
(@prodigy)
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Let's run through this real quick because it's Friday and I get off work in less than a minute.  When I ran DTDW our blocking scheme for 99% of our plays was TKO playside, backside guard and tackle pull to the point of attack, backside tight-end superman's the hole left by the tackle and guard.  Same blocking whether we're running power, counter, criss cross counter, counter cutback or whatever, the blocking all looks the same.  The chief difference is going to be in the backfield action.

So if you try to blitz playside C gap you're going to get hammered down on, it's a mess there.  We often ran our plays against a defense of 15 or more players and stacked the point of attack AND told the defense where the play was going.  Sometimes our offense failed to move the ball forward against these odds.  It was rare but sometimes it happened and we would step back from it all and troubleshoot WHY and the majority of the time it was because someone in our TKO didn't do what they were supposed to.  Long story short, playside C blitz isn't going to work if everyone does their job because the C gap actually disappears and anyone in that area is going to get severely angle blocked out of the space.  You're going to have a fullback and a QB to contend with also.  If you somehow manage to avoid the wall and then try to come in and make the tackle, you're probably going to give up 3 yards per carry.  If you blitz in after the wall passes you, you're probably going to miss the WB as he's running past you.

Now backside, if you somehow manage to avoid the TE filling the gap and the center coming down and you are trying to chase the WB from behind...you MIGHT, MIGHT MIGHT get lucky...MIGHT.  Usually this will work against a sloppy double wing team, one that isn't getting out of the backfield quickly enough, one that isn't timed right.  You might even catch one of my backs if the QB bobbled the snap or something or the WB missed the exchange or the motion was off but you're not going to have consistent success with this because the only way this would work is if you go all in chasing motion.  You're operating under the assumption that the motion back is getting the ball so you're going to open yourself up to be countered.

We lost one game in 2 years after I had my stuff together and my hat is off to the coach who pulled it off.  We didn't adjust.  His approach was to sit his biggest boys flexed off of the C and use LB's to fill.  He basically ran our own defense against us and then he had an answer offensively to capitalize on a defensive weakness we had.  It was still a close game.

If you show up for a fair fight, you are unprepared.


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Seth54
(@seth54)
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For the guys that run power as a handoff instead of a pitch, what is the quarterbacks assignment after the handoff? I most experienced with the super power, with the quarterback pitching and then leading through the hole. Just curious what guys do it after the handoff?


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Prodigy
(@prodigy)
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Joined: 11 years ago
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@seth54

I never ran it like this but if you look at Wyatts stuff, the QB runs a “hockey stick”.  I think the idea is to threaten boot or pass.  I never ran it this way because I had a QB who was excellent with the pitch and could block.  I had two really nasty WB’s.  If I started swapping stuff around to put a quicker / more athletic kid in at QB to threaten boot, then I would have sacrificed at WB and frankly I liked the balance and symmetry of having two excellent wings and a really fast FB.

If you show up for a fair fight, you are unprepared.


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CoachDP
(@coachdp)
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Posted by: @terrypjohnson

@coachdp - Here's how this conversation started:

Since I'm new to the area, I said, "Hey, I see that the top two teams run the Double Wing pretty well. That's a fun offense to watch".

"They're not hard to stop, just blitz the C gap".

If "the top two teams run the Double Wing pretty well," then how is it that "They're not hard to stop, just blitz the C gap"(?)  

If you're one of the top two teams then your offense is pretty hard to stop.  At least, for the rest of the teams in your conference.

--Dave

"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

The Mission Statement: "I want to show any young man that he is far tougher than he thinks, that he can accomplish more than what he dreamed and that his work ethic will take him wherever he wants to go."

#BattleReady newhope


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CoachDP
(@coachdp)
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Joined: 12 years ago
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Posted by: @seth54

For the guys that run power as a handoff instead of a pitch, what is the quarterbacks assignment after the handoff? I most experienced with the super power, with the quarterback pitching and then leading through the hole. Just curious what guys do it after the handoff?

On Power Right, the QB has a clockwise pivot to the off-set Fullback (3 o'clock), then to the motioning WingBack (7 o'clock), then boots out the backside (to the left).  Once the backside OLB and/or CB fall asleep, the QB fakes to that WingBack and keeps it.  You have Wedge, Power, XX, Yo-Yo and Boot at your disposal.

--Dave

"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

The Mission Statement: "I want to show any young man that he is far tougher than he thinks, that he can accomplish more than what he dreamed and that his work ethic will take him wherever he wants to go."

#BattleReady newhope


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Bob Goodman
(@bob-goodman)
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Posted by: @coachdp
Posted by: @seth54

For the guys that run power as a handoff instead of a pitch, what is the quarterbacks assignment after the handoff? I most experienced with the super power, with the quarterback pitching and then leading through the hole. Just curious what guys do it after the handoff?

On Power Right, the QB has a clockwise pivot to the off-set Fullback (3 o'clock), then to the motioning WingBack (7 o'clock), then boots out the backside (to the left).

You may recall that last year I wanted to convince our HC and OC to run our buck sweep action (wing T 20 series) that way, including the FB offset, but then our season was canceled.  This year I don't even know yet who I have to convince, I just know the club has assigned me to be an AC again.

it's just that the footwork would be spread over more space in wing T than in a tight DW.


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terrypjohnson
(@terrypjohnson)
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Topic starter  
Posted by: @coachdp

If "the top two teams run the Double Wing pretty well," then how is it that "They're not hard to stop, just blitz the C gap"(?)  

If you're one of the top two teams then your offense is pretty hard to stop.  At least, for the rest of the teams in your conference.

--Dave

This was the travel ball coach talking. Unfortunately, my boys won't be able in that league because they didn't have a team for my middle son to play on. 

I guess it goes without saying that I agree with you. A few weeks after I wrote this, I watched those two teams play the fourth-place team in the league. They scored 56 and 47 points, respectively, by "running only two plays" (wedge and power).

Fight 'em until Hell freezes over, then fight 'em on the ice -- Dutch Meyer


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terrypjohnson
(@terrypjohnson)
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Topic starter  

Thank you, Coach @prodigy ... this pretty much confirmed my initial thought!

Fight 'em until Hell freezes over, then fight 'em on the ice -- Dutch Meyer


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bdjackson
(@bdjackson)
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@mahonz

I was actually discussing this at our coaches meeting last night. I told them the worst thing someone could do is put a monster LB outside my WB and have him annihilate the hole. Granted I have three blockers coming through, but that and a hard crashing DE are my two main concerns. Thankfully, everyone always assumes that sweep is the end all be all at 6-8's so I normally only have DE's that take themselves out of the play. Tack on our crazy defensive restrictions and the DW is extraordinarily dominant on paper, on the field, that depends on the coach. 

 

--Brian

Being Capable, first begins with being Confident.


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mahonz
(@mahonz)
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Posted by: @bdjackson

@mahonz

I was actually discussing this at our coaches meeting last night. I told them the worst thing someone could do is put a monster LB outside my WB and have him annihilate the hole. Granted I have three blockers coming through, but that and a hard crashing DE are my two main concerns. Thankfully, everyone always assumes that sweep is the end all be all at 6-8's so I normally only have DE's that take themselves out of the play. Tack on our crazy defensive restrictions and the DW is extraordinarily dominant on paper, on the field, that depends on the coach. 

 

--Brian

Fortunately monster LB'rs will be few and far between at this level. Not that some of these kids cant be a monster but more so that they are still learning how to be a monster. IMHO...if you can get the right players blocking the right Defenders you win. I think learning to play solid Defense is harder than leaning how to block.  

What is beautiful, lives forever.


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