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Sharkbait
(@sharkbait)
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Joined: 5 years ago
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Topic starter  

i would like to change the way our org has named the plays we call. It seems that the old way has concepts that mean different things on different plays and doesn't leave the window open for being creative without creating a new name for the kids to memorize. I feel that if the play calling is consistently named we could teach the language of the plays and the kids would have less to memorize. Now that being said, I am a new coach, 3 years of tackle and 5 years of flag. Not all the coaches in my org would want that change. Since I have the youngest team, they would like for everyone to be on the same page, so as they move up they all hear the same thing. I agree with being on the same page. How should I present my case to them to get the support from the long time coaches who have called it a certain way for a long time.

Changes are not really new names, just the way a play name is structured. I would like to separate the backfield action from the blocking scheme.
Stuff like

pro blue 33 belly = blue belly 33 x-block
47 belly sweep=belly 47 sweep
28 buck sweep= buck 28 jack
32 buck trap=buck 32 trap

Trap is a good example. I run it 3 ways but only want the o-line to have to remember 1.

buck 32 trap
blue belly 22 trap
veer 52 trap

Am I over thinking this? lol but coaching is more fun when I dive deep.


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Spyder89
(@spyder89)
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Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 184
 

IMO, you're overthinking it.  From the looks of it, you're really only changing the order that the play is called, except for a couple plays (in which you add new terminology to the playcall which makes it longer and possibly more confusing for kids).  The o-line is already only looking for that trigger word(s) to tell them what to do, putting it in a different order is only going to confuse those who already know the wing-T lingo.

- Ray


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ZACH
 ZACH
(@bucksweep58)
Diamond
Joined: 10 years ago
Posts: 9499
 

One word play calls
http://www.dumcoach.com/general-discussion/one-word-play-calls/

My post:

We did this 3 seasons ago, we used phonetic alphabet. 1 formation always set to the field.  Worked well...

https://www.osric.com/chris/phonetic.html

We used states but kids arent smart with geography,  i suppose.

If you add formations and motions obviousley you need more words.

https://www.xandolabs.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=3316:multiple-one-word-play-calls-for-tempo-offense-2&catid=94&Itemid=162

http://www.footballperspective.com/and-then-tom-said-to-his-offense-bama-left/

http://highspeedspreadfootball.blogspot.com/2015/01/using-one-word-calls-in-tempo-offense.html?m=1

https://coachgrabowski.wordpress.com/2013/02/12/one-word-play-calls/

I can explain it to you, I can't understand if for you.


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blockandtackle
(@coacharnold)
Silver
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 847
 

Honestly, I think you're barking up the wrong tree here.  Are all of your teams running the exact same offense at all levels?  If not, then terminology is not going to carry over because there's no universal offensive playbook in football unless your organization gives them all a playbook they're required to use.

Also, I think it's best to let the coaches teach what they know.  A Double Wing team would probably want to call things very differently from a spread team or an option team.  They have their reasons for this.

Another thing: I suggest keeping the playcalls short and to the point.  The fewer words, the fewer opportunities for kids to mishear something and the simpler it'll feel for them.  You can use first letters of the word to group things tgoether for the OL (all "P" words=block Power scheme up front) and  the type of word being used (places, sodas, foods, boys' names, girls' names, animals, etc.) to group the backfield action together for the type of play being ran.  That both cuts down on verbiage AND keeps it simple.


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CoachDP
(@coachdp)
Kryptonite
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 17796
 

Honestly, I think you're barking up the wrong tree here.  Are all of your teams running the exact same offense at all levels?  If not, then terminology is not going to carry over because there's no universal offensive playbook in football unless your organization gives them all a playbook they're required to use.

--^ This.

Also, I think it's best to let the coaches teach what they know.  A Double Wing team would probably want to call things very differently from a spread team or an option team.  They have their reasons for this.

--^ Thank you.

--Dave

"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

The Mission Statement: "I want to show any young man that he is far tougher than he thinks, that he can accomplish more than what he dreamed and that his work ethic will take him wherever he wants to go."

#BattleReady newhope


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SingleWingGoombah
(@singlewinggoombah)
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Joined: 7 years ago
Posts: 2070
 

I cant imagine the org is not all running the same offense if they are all having to use the same playcalls... If they are not using the same offense, then there is no way you should all be using the same verbage.

The thing about calling plays is that it is more important for it to work for the kids, than it is the coach. 

It looks like you are mixing up things like belly as a blocking scheme and a tag in your suggested play names.  I think it would be confusing for kids to have a 23 belly, and a belly 47 sweep.  At least it would be if you explain play call diagramming. 


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CoachDP
(@coachdp)
Kryptonite
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 17796
 

i would like to change the way our org has named the plays we call.

--If your org allows you to call your plays on your team the way you'd want to call them, then why concern yourself about how another coach in your org calls his plays?

Not all the coaches in my org would want that change.

--Then leave it alone and coach YOUR team.

Since I have the youngest team, they would like for everyone to be on the same page, so as they move up they all hear the same thing. I agree with being on the same page. How should I present my case to them to get the support from the long time coaches who have called it a certain way for a long time.

--A foolhardy exercise.  Players have no trouble at all learning new plays, drills, terminology, schemes, etc. every year.

Am I over thinking this?

--I don't think it's an issue of overthinking, as long as the thinking you're doing applies only to your squad.  Leave the others alone.

lol but coaching is more fun when I dive deep.

--Then "dive deep" with your team.  If I were coaching in your org and you told me, "Dave, I've come up with a new way for you to call your plays and guess what?  It's just like the way I call my plays!"  And then you laid out your play-call examples....I'd tell you to come back when you had a good idea.  Actually, I'd just tell you to leave me alone.

--Dave

"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

The Mission Statement: "I want to show any young man that he is far tougher than he thinks, that he can accomplish more than what he dreamed and that his work ethic will take him wherever he wants to go."

#BattleReady newhope


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CoachDP
(@coachdp)
Kryptonite
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 17796
 

It looks like you are mixing up things like belly as a blocking scheme and a tag in your suggested play names.  I think it would be confusing for kids to have a 23 belly, and a belly 47 sweep.

Perhaps that's why I'm confused...

--Dave

"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

The Mission Statement: "I want to show any young man that he is far tougher than he thinks, that he can accomplish more than what he dreamed and that his work ethic will take him wherever he wants to go."

#BattleReady newhope


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Sharkbait
(@sharkbait)
Copper
Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 38
Topic starter  

This would be the same playbook for all levels. We run the same offense from top to bottom. The reason I didn't like 1 word plays was, it dosen't work for all levels. works for the little guys or if it is only for 1 team.When you add formations, motion and different backfield action then line has to learn more plays. For example this past season we had plays with the backfield running one thing and the line blocking another. Backs running belly and the line blocking buck sweep, 2 plays 1 blocking scheme.

I wouldn't use all these plays but would think it would be easier  having consistant language when the older levels run their stuff. I guess I'm thinking more about playbook design and less team specific concepts.


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Sharkbait
(@sharkbait)
Copper
Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 38
Topic starter  

I think it would be confusing for kids to have a 23 belly, and a belly 47 sweep.  At least it would be if you explain play call diagramming.

This is what I mean, currently there is no consistency in the play naming. I was thinking it is easier to completely separate backfield action and blocking scheme. so line never blocks belly but blocks x block,sweep, trap etc.


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CoachDP
(@coachdp)
Kryptonite
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 17796
 

The reason I didn't like 1 word plays was, it dosen't work for all levels.

--Question: Does it work for YOUR team?  If it does, then leave it alone.  If it doesn't, then fix it for your team.

works for the little guys or if it is only for 1 team.

--If it works for the "little guys" then I'm confused why it doesn't work for everyone.  I'm picturing the 13-year-old QB complaining to his OC, "Coach, I just can't pick up that terminology that the Tiny Mites are using.  It's too complex."

When you add formations, motion and different backfield action then line has to learn more plays.

--No.  We have 11(?) different blocking schemes/tags and regardless of what the formation is or what the motion is, ALL THEY HAVE TO LISTEN FOR IS THEIR TAG.  Whether it's "Flex Right, B-Slant, Lee Jet, 45 Counter Naked Roger-Trap" or "36 Larry-G," our linemen are simply waiting to hear their tag (Wedge, Trap, Hinge, Reach, G, etc.). It doesn't matter how many plays we have, linemen learn the Tags.

--Dave

"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

The Mission Statement: "I want to show any young man that he is far tougher than he thinks, that he can accomplish more than what he dreamed and that his work ethic will take him wherever he wants to go."

#BattleReady newhope


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ZACH
 ZACH
(@bucksweep58)
Diamond
Joined: 10 years ago
Posts: 9499
 

This would be the same playbook for all levels. We run the same offense from top to bottom. The reason I didn't like 1 word plays was, it dosen't work for all levels. works for the little guys or if it is only for 1 team.When you add formations, motion and different backfield action then line has to learn more plays. For example this past season we had plays with the backfield running one thing and the line blocking another. Backs running belly and the line blocking buck sweep, 2 plays 1 blocking scheme.

I wouldn't use all these plays but would think it would be easier  having consistant language when the older levels run their stuff. I guess I'm thinking more about playbook design and less team specific concepts.

If you build your own plays on the fly i guess you would have an issue. Also too much play language is an issue for your qb and the kids listening.

Basic play language ive always used

Formation +shift/motion +shift/motion + play action + poa +additional cue additional cue.

Strong larry liz 20 count

Line up in strong
Larry shift
Liz motion with 5
Outside zone right
Count outside in after larry shift

If i was running dw ide use one name calls and trach the play with motion, like unless i say no mo, youre moving

Toss right - jerry (who ever plays A back)
Toss left - tom (who ever play c back)
Wedge xx - bill ( who ever plays b back)
Counter left- jerrys fav color
counter right- toms fav color
fb trap  - bills fav color

Less is more, but everyone likes to make things harder for some reason.

I can explain it to you, I can't understand if for you.


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Spyder89
(@spyder89)
Bronze
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 184
 

This is what I mean, currently there is no consistency in the play naming. I was thinking it is easier to completely separate backfield action and blocking scheme. so line never blocks belly but blocks x block,sweep, trap etc.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding, but how is their no consistency?  The Wing-T has deep roots and all of the plays truly make sense if you understand what you are coaching. 

Is your playbook a bunch of made up plays from someone in the org?

- Ray


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SingleWingGoombah
(@singlewinggoombah)
Gold
Joined: 7 years ago
Posts: 2070
 

Formation, motion and backfield action should have minimal affect, if any on what the line does.  Like if you were changing from a back kicking out a DE, to the TE tunnel blocking it, that would be different, but that type of change is best done via tag 36 power vs tunnel 36 power. Something like that.

I think its easier to just teach the line that the last word is their blocking rule and to listen for that.  I use water breaks in the first few practice to teach play call diagramming.  Really hammer it into them, and once the ball is rolling it picks speed up fast.  Especially as a wing t team.


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CoachDP
(@coachdp)
Kryptonite
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 17796
 

If you really want to simply, just write down that player's responsibility on a wrist-coach.  So if you yell, "Play 11" and the players look at their wrist coach, you already know the play is "Flex Right, B-Slant, Lee Jet, 45 Counter Naked Roger-Trap."  But the wrist coach for the players would read:

Right End: Play 11 "Flex Right, Run Slant"
Right Wing: Play 11 "Carry to Left Tackle"
Right Tackle: Play 11 "Pull & Lead"
Right Guard: Play 11 "Trap"
Center: Play 11 "MOMA"
Left Guard: Play 11 "Double With Center/2nd Level"
Left Tackle: Play 11 "2nd Level"
Left End: Play 11 "2nd Level"
Left Wing: Play 11 "Jet Motion Open Basket"
Fullback: Play 11 "Kick Out Right Side"
QB: Play 11 "Counter Spin Boot Leg. Hand Off to RWB."

Wrist coaches will let you do whatever you want.

--Dave

"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

The Mission Statement: "I want to show any young man that he is far tougher than he thinks, that he can accomplish more than what he dreamed and that his work ethic will take him wherever he wants to go."

#BattleReady newhope


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