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Coach Kyle
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Considering doing a sugar huddle this year. We'll break huddle, and we'll try to get the ball off in 3 seconds tops. I'm scared that we'll get slowed by the refs. Has anyone ran into this problem?

Deaths while walking 4,743Deaths from football 12


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Coyote
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Posted by: @coach-kyle

get the ball off in 3 seconds tops ...     slowed by the refs

With my age group, I'd be more concerned that we'd be legally set for a full second before the snap.  

Re: The Refs ... I guess it'd be a matter of whether the other team's D was running kids in and out a lot.   Seems they might slow you down so the Def could make their substitutions.   Other wise, unless there was some "house rule" on the matter, don't see why the refs would get involved. 

Maybe others have more insight...  But if you can break huddle, get to the LOS, and get set legally in under 3 seconds - one of which the team would have to be still - Kudos. 

This post was modified 2 months ago by Coyote

Umm.... why does that 6 ft tall 9 yr old have a goatee...?


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chucknduck
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Used it with 3rd graders before.  No problems with officials.  Used it while in Beast mode, very difficult for the defense to react to Beast right or Beast left that quickly.


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Coach Kyle
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@chucknduck That's exactly what I'm thinking about doing. That and 90% of the time we're going to go a balanced line.

Deaths while walking 4,743Deaths from football 12


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Prodigy
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Never really ran a huddle. Had a huddle installed as an actual play call to control the clock but only used it a few times.

Ran no huddle, warp speed 100% of the time and we waited on the referees regularly. Offense would start on the LOS, referee would spot the ball and blow the whistle and our cadence would start. After the play was whistled dead, our team was instructed to find the referee and the ball and immediately line up again to run the next play.  As soon as the whistle was blown, our cadence would start.

We ran one formation, so it wasn't as if we were trying to throw something weird out onto the field and do it fast enough that the defense couldn't react.  I think that's a really poor way of trying to gain an edge in a youth football game.  Personally, I'd much rather have some core plays that are pretty well bulletproof as far as execution and rely on misdirection in the play itself rather than screw around with various formations and trying to put something out on the field that the defense doesn't adjust to.

With no huddle, we'd be at the line and the play call would come in...if we seen a target of opportunity with the defense, we could SCRATCH SCRATCH SCRATCH and change the play call. 

At the youth level, I think most referees control the pace of the game with their spots and whistles.  They'll find ways of slowing the offense down if they want to..."Hey, buckle your chinstrap, tie your shoe...bring in your substitutions because minimum play rule is a factor."

I don't think there was ever a time, despite running at warp speed where the opposing team got caught in the middle of trying to make a substitution or anything like that.  You'd think there would be but the referees regulate it all. 

If you show up for a fair fight, you are unprepared.


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CoachDP
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Posted by: @coach-kyle

Considering doing a sugar huddle this year. We'll break huddle, and we'll try to get the ball off in 3 seconds tops. I'm scared that we'll get slowed by the refs. Has anyone ran into this problem?

Kyle, don't concern yourself with the refs slowing down your offense.  If your offense is lined up and ready to snap the ball and the ref is standing over it, the defense has to be ready as well because the ref is getting ready to allow play.  While you may not be exhausting their defensive personnel by running a play every 10 seconds, you are preventing subbing, as well as making sure their defense hurries to get in place.  I've never seen a defense lallygag when the ref was standing over the ball and the offense was ready to snap it.

--Dave

"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

The Mission Statement: "I want to show any young man that he is far tougher than he thinks, that he can accomplish more than what he dreamed and that his work ethic will take him wherever he wants to go."

#BattleReady newhope


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Coach Kyle
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@prodigy 100% of the reason for running this sugar huddle is to disguse the play. I don't want them to know what formation is coming. Unbalanced? Balanced? Nasty split?

Deaths while walking 4,743Deaths from football 12


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CoachDP
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Posted by: @coach-kyle

@prodigy 100% of the reason for running this sugar huddle is to disguse the play. I don't want them to know what formation is coming. Unbalanced? Balanced? Nasty split?

We would line up in our base formation and then shift during cadence.

--Dave

"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

The Mission Statement: "I want to show any young man that he is far tougher than he thinks, that he can accomplish more than what he dreamed and that his work ethic will take him wherever he wants to go."

#BattleReady newhope


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Coach Kyle
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Posted by: @coachdp
Posted by: @coach-kyle

@prodigy 100% of the reason for running this sugar huddle is to disguse the play. I don't want them to know what formation is coming. Unbalanced? Balanced? Nasty split?

We would line up in our base formation and then shift during cadence.

--Dave

The thing about shifting is that the opposing coach sees it and knows to do something. With unbalanced they don't always seem to notice. 

Deaths while walking 4,743Deaths from football 12


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CoachDP
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Posted by: @coach-kyle

The thing about shifting is that the opposing coach sees it and knows to do something. With unbalanced they don't always seem to notice. 

So do you want him to notice, or not?

--Dave

"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

The Mission Statement: "I want to show any young man that he is far tougher than he thinks, that he can accomplish more than what he dreamed and that his work ethic will take him wherever he wants to go."

#BattleReady newhope


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Prodigy
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Kyle, 

 

for whatever it’s worth, the defense I ran with players as young as 7, would automatically account for balanced / unbalanced fronts.

If, your sugar huddle and unbalanced approach gives you an edge, eventually that edge will be lost as teams scout you and such…then you’re just back to execution.

If you show up for a fair fight, you are unprepared.


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Coach Kyle
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@prodigy I agree that execution matters. However, the ability to put pressure on the defense very useful. And there is the ability to control the clock.

 

If you read any of the DC manuals, some things are easier for a offense than for a defense to teach. So if the defense needs to spend 20 minutes teaching how to defend something that I spent 5 minutes to teach. That's a win for the offense. 

Deaths while walking 4,743Deaths from football 12


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Coach Kyle
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Posted by: @coachdp
Posted by: @coach-kyle

The thing about shifting is that the opposing coach sees it and knows to do something. With unbalanced they don't always seem to notice. 

So do you want him to notice, or not?

--Dave

I suppose that depends on your goal.

Deaths while walking 4,743Deaths from football 12


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gumby_in_co
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FWIW, a friend of mine is going to run some Beast next season, so I went over all of my film last year and drew up the fronts that we saw, one opponent at a time. Not one team matched us 5.5 to the left and 5.5 to the right. Not even Troy, who runs an unbalanced offense.

 

I think sugar huddling and/or shifting to an unbalanced line will test the best coached defenses, especially if unbalanced is part of your offense.

When in doot . . . glass and oot.


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Seth54
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@gumby_in_co 

Do you run Beast with mega splits? 

I believe I saw you run Power as the primary play (Backs blocking Down, Kick out, and Wrap from outside to inside as I recall), how do you run your primary counter?


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