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Dimson
(@dimson)
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Joined: 10 years ago
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Posted by: @coachdp
Posted by: @dimson

@coachdp yes, 9 points a game is truly awful. And 19 ppg isn't that great either but for our league and our age group it isn't that bad. We only play 8 minute quarters and they go by quickly due to almost no passing. 

--I don't understand what "for our league and age group" means.  When I coached 7-8s, we averaged more than 30 and weren't able to be on offense after we hit Slaughter.  I understand about 8-minute quarters.  When I coached middle school, we played 8-minute quarters and lead the league in scoring (29+ ppg).  And we had little passing because we were running the Double Wing.  And I can tell you in the 44 points per game we're averaging this year, that if 2 minutes were removed from each of our quarters, it'd have made little difference to our points output, so I don't get your point.

I wanted to do besst as we had to try something and we had already had some pistol/ gun plays in our play book and it would get our guys running down hill instead of waiting for the ball.

--There is no offense where your runningbacks should be waiting for the ball.  Beast (or any other offense) won't cure that.  

It didn't fail due to lack of teaching the kids how to do it. It failed due to coaching on game day. I overestimated my HCs ability to run Beast and at least make sure the kids were lined up properly. 

--There is no offense on the planet that is simpler than Beast.  That your.  header can't run it speaks volumes.  That being said, there's no way to expect proficiency in any offense where you've had only one practice.  

--Dave

 

I don't disagree with you the offenses could be better. I am just glad I don't have to face a coordinator/ HC like you in our league. I have little doubt you wouldn't average 30 in our league too. I don't know if the over all talent is down or it is bad coaching but our most dominate team in our age group only averaged 19 points. Now they did have some big games but the also had a game or two where they only scored 6. Our biggest scoring game was 18 and that was our first game of the season. 

Our biggest issue in my opinion is we focused way too much on conditioning compared to execution of the offense. The other issue was relying on one player to do all the scoring and not doing a proper job of developing our other offensive talent. If it were my call, things would have been different but there was only so much I could do since I was not the HC or the OC. We had the talent, we just were not able to utilize it properly. 

We ended up having two practices but that should have been enough to at least have the kids line up properly due to a coach being on the field. But that just wasn't the case. The blocking backs were somehow deeper than the Beast back and the line was not unbalanced as planned. We had a split end for some reason. And we never adjusted the formation. It was frustrating to watch to say the least. 


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gumby_in_co
(@gumby_in_co)
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@coachdp I thought about your response about bad snaps, penalties, turnovers, etc. quite a bit last night. I've decided that for next year, I am killing the direct snaps. Enough is enough. We had at least one bad snap in every game and in some, we had several. Since my OC is moving to Montana, I don't have to argue about it anymore. 

Allowing bad snaps to kill our offense is 100% on me. Bad snaps cost us one football game for sure. Vs Troy and another top tier team, we were in the game at half time. Bad snaps ensured that we had no chance to win. Against poor teams, it was not a big deal. If we ended up in 3rd and 12, we'd just break off a big play and start over. Against the good teams, we're going to have to play ball control. 

I have used every tool in my coaching kit to fix the snaps. 4 straight seasons of not being able to train a competent and consistent snapper. Even the one we "discovered" late in the season had at least 1 and often 2 bad snaps in each of our 3 playoff games. No more. 

I believe that eliminating bad shotgun snaps alone will have us knocking on the door of the top 5. 

We never had a punt blocked.  We are better than most teams on KO and KR. Our PAT kick needs to improve or we just need to go for 1 (run/pass for PAT). Snap is good 90% of the time. Hold is good 80% of the time. Kick is good 10% of the time. So if we don't have someone emerge as a kicker, we'll scrap it. I have no idea how to coach up a kicker.

Fumbles were not a consistent problem. I think we had less than 5 all season, but we will put a bigger emphasis on protecting the ball.

We threw a high number of interceptions, but I can fix that. If I can't, we'll dramatically strip down our passing game. We have a very promising QB for next year. He couldn't play QB this year because he was over the weight limit. 

Offensive procedure penalties were in issue early, but we fixed them.  Jumping offside on defense was only an issue in 1 game and we fixed it. Holding . . . sigh.  Not sure. I don't think we have a holding problem. I honestly think we have a ref problem. I might give you a call about the X-man blocking. 

When in doot . . . glass and oot.


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DKTurtle
(@dkturtle)
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Posted by: @coachdp
Posted by: @dkturtle  Jimmys and Joes matter.  To this day I believe the best season I had as a coach was leading team to a 1-6 regular season record.
 

Of course they do.  But it's not the only thing that matters, nor even the most important thing.  Because coaching matters most.  And you may well have gotten the most that anyone could have gotten out of that 1-6 team.  And if that's the case, props to you. 

However, the youth ball that I typically see (not just in this area, but in the amount of video that I see from around the country), Jimmys and Joes ARE THE SINGLE MOST IMPORTANT ASPECT in winning or losing a game.  Reason being, when two coaching staffs are equal (or, equally inept) it is Jimmy that has made the difference.  When Coach Bubba says, "We could have won that game if we'd had their #21 on our team," he speaks the truth because he doesn't know how to overcome the talent deficiency on his team.  Heck, he doesn't even know how to overcome his 7 bad snaps, his 4 turnovers and his blocked kick.  In his mind, that was just "bad luck."  In his mind, it was all about #21 on the other team.  And he'd be right.  Because #21's coach had 7 fumbles, 4 bad snaps and 6 off-side penalties on his team.  In the land of the blind, it's the one-eyed man who's king.

--Dave

 

I never said it was all that matters or the most important thing. If it were, the team I was refering to would not have won 3 games. I know youth football is a bit different everywhere, but I am rarely jealous of another teams stud, I'm usually jealous of their depth. In my area youth teams are based on high school school districts. The organization I was with at the time is the smallest school in the state. Because we play youth ball against programs near us rather than playing the same programs the high school plays against, we would play youth teams drawing talent from school districts 2 and 3 classes larger. Within that context, this was the least talented team I've ever had. If you were to rank players on the field at any given time from 1 to 22, my team that year usually had 7 or 8 of the bottom 10. That's a talent gap that I find much more difficult to overcome than the other team having the 1 best player on the field. Of course that year we were at both disadvantages. 

If you are a good enough coach to overcome that, then I hope to get to your level. I'm not, but I felt I got those guys playing about as well as I could. 

Practice makes permanent. Perfect practice makes perfect.


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CoachDP
(@coachdp)
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Posted by: @dimson
 
I don't disagree with you the offenses could be better. I am just glad I don't have to face a coordinator/ HC like you in our league.
 
--No, no, no Chris.  You should always want to face the best competition you can.  You don't get better by lowering the bar.  You get better by being not accepting of your own status quo, whatever that may be.  Raise your own bar. 
 
I don't know if the over all talent is down or it is bad coaching but our most dominate team in our age group only averaged 19 points.
 
--Even if "the over all talent is down," then isn't that the case for everyone?  Or are you the exception?
 
Now they did have some big games but the also had a game or two where they only scored 6.
 
--If they won those games, that means they were 6-0 wins.  In youth ball, since the majority of starters are two-way players, the quality of your offense should be equal to the quality of your defense.  A 6-0 win tells me that the defense was good, but the offense was awful.  How can that be if it's predominantly the same personnel?  OR, it means that the winning team's offense was awful and the losing team's offense was even worse.  And that's the issue I see more than 90% of the time.  
 
--I'll refer back to my friend who is one win away from going to Florida for the national championship.  He lost one game this year, 6-0.  The other games he won and won big.  Not because he has a dominant team, but because his opposition has been terrible.  I've been to his practice, and he has solid kids.  They're not superior athletes, but they listen well and play hard.  He could have won that game just by better execution on his part.  (I've watched it on Hudl several times and we've talked about it.)  His opponent didn't beat him.  He simply lost it on his own.

 
 
Our biggest issue in my opinion is we focused way too much on conditioning compared to execution of the offense. 
 
--Another common mistake, if your conditioning is lasting longer than 10-12 minutes, or you're running mindless laps. ("Don't be last!")  Keep in mind that most coaches (particularly at the youth level) are just trying to find ways to FILL a 2-hour practice, so "conditioning" (which doesn't really make you any stronger, or even in "better condition") as it pertains to the drills usually used (jumping jacks, pushups, grass pulls, stretching...) serves as an excellent time-filler/waster in much the same way that scrimmaging does.  That being said, I probably condition more than any youth team and probably more so than many high school teams (outside of the weight room), but ours is for mental conditioning/Mojo development.
 
The other issue was relying on one player to do all the scoring and not doing a proper job of developing our other offensive talent.
 
--And that's just short-sightedness (i.e., bad coaching).  An offense (even one that relies primarily on the running game) still needs to be as diverse as possible.  Not just to give you more scoring options, but so you aren't so heavily invested in one single cog of the entire machine.  If you lose that player due to injury, then you've gone from one-dimensional to non-dimensional.
 
We had the talent, we just were not able to utilize it properly. 
 
--And that's my point, exactly.
 
It was frustrating to watch to say the least. 
 
--Oh, I can't imagine myself coaching with him.
 
--Dave
 

 

 

"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

The Mission Statement: "I want to show any young man that he is far tougher than he thinks, that he can accomplish more than what he dreamed and that his work ethic will take him wherever he wants to go."

#BattleReady newhope


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CoachDP
(@coachdp)
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Joined: 12 years ago
Posts: 18111
 
Posted by: @dkturtle

I never said it was all that matters or the most important thing.

--True enough.  And I apologize if I made it sound as if that was your belief.  

If it were, the team I was refering to would not have won 3 games. I know youth football is a bit different everywhere, but I am rarely jealous of another teams stud, I'm usually jealous of their depth. In my area youth teams are based on high school school districts. The organization I was with at the time is the smallest school in the state. Because we play youth ball against programs near us rather than playing the same programs the high school plays against, we would play youth teams drawing talent from school districts 2 and 3 classes larger. Within that context, this was the least talented team I've ever had. If you were to rank players on the field at any given time from 1 to 22, my team that year usually had 7 or 8 of the bottom 10. That's a talent gap that I find much more difficult to overcome than the other team having the 1 best player on the field. Of course that year we were at both disadvantages. 

--I understand what you're saying.  But rare is the game (or game film) that I've seen where the losing team was well-coached (a. Ran a legitimate scheme. b. Did not incur penalties. c. Did not turnover the ball. d. Did not have players out of position). If I saw a team that met those 4 factors, they were the winning team. And none of those factors have ANYTHING to do with talent (of your team or your opponent's).  

--I've coached with three different youth orgs...my initial org where I was a header for 12 years, a different team/org in 2018, back to my original org in 2019, no youth ball in Covid-2020 and the new team I'm with now.  I don't sit back and field offers and pick the choicest fruit.  I went where I saw a need and thought I could help.  (At the beginning of this year, I went to watch a friend's practice and they were sharp and on-point.  I don't think I could have helped them and they certainly didn't need me, so I moved on.)  But I've been fortunate to be with successful teams at each stop along the way.  We're undefeated this year with this new org; the youth team I coached with in 2019 played for the Pop Warner National Championship, and the year before I coached with a new (for me) youth org where we went 8-1 losing in the conference title game (to the coach whose practice I watched at the beginning of this season).  With each team we ran a legitimate scheme, didn't shoot ourselves in the foot, and had players in position to make plays.  

--The number one reason that I've seen touchdowns given up were because defensive players were not in the correct position.  It had nothing to do with speed (speed can help you overcome being OUT OF POSITION), talent, athleticism or even if someone was aggressive.  Even in our games this year, we get tackled (i.e., stopped 3/4s of the time).  When we score it's when defenders find themselves out of position.  If we score 6 TDs, and ran the ball 24 times, it means our opponent stopped us from scoring on 75% of the plays we ran.  That means our opponent can stop us; they can tackle us.  But on only 6 plays they weren't in position to do so.  We aren't face-planting and stiff-arming kids on our way to the end-zone.

If you are a good enough coach to overcome that, then I hope to get to your level. I'm not, but I felt I got those guys playing about as well as I could. 

All we can do is do the best we can.  But that doesn't mean it's the best that can be done with them.  The number of times I've watched Hugh Wyatt run the Double Wing better with MY players, than with me coaching MY players has given me an apples to apples comparison on more than one occasion. 

--Dave

 

"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

The Mission Statement: "I want to show any young man that he is far tougher than he thinks, that he can accomplish more than what he dreamed and that his work ethic will take him wherever he wants to go."

#BattleReady newhope


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CoachDP
(@coachdp)
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Joined: 12 years ago
Posts: 18111
 
Posted by: @gumby_in_co

@coachdp I thought about your response about bad snaps, penalties, turnovers, etc. quite a bit last night. I've decided that for next year, I am killing the direct snaps. Enough is enough. We had at least one bad snap in every game and in some, we had several. Since my OC is moving to Montana, I don't have to argue about it anymore. 

--You're the header, Lar.  Why argue? 

Allowing bad snaps to kill our offense is 100% on me. Bad snaps cost us one football game for sure. Vs Troy and another top tier team, we were in the game at half time. Bad snaps ensured that we had no chance to win. Against poor teams, it was not a big deal. If we ended up in 3rd and 12, we'd just break off a big play and start over. Against the good teams, we're going to have to play ball control. 

--Good luck playing ball control.  I really hope you'll do it.  Teams just aren't set up to deal with that approach to football, especially youth coaches.  I've said it before, the typical youth football scoring sequence goes something like this:

1st & 10: No gain.

2nd & 10: Fumble, no gain.

3rd & 10: Gain negated by penalty.

3rd & 17 (down replayed): Snap goes over head for 10-yard loss.

4th & 27: Fast kid gets outside while Cornerbacks are lined up inside the Linebackers.  Ball-carrier runs 72 yards for a touchdown. 

I have used every tool in my coaching kit to fix the snaps. 4 straight seasons of not being able to train a competent and consistent snapper. Even the one we "discovered" late in the season had at least 1 and often 2 bad snaps in each of our 3 playoff games. No more. 

--It can be done.  You have two options: Learn how to teach it, or just don't do it. 

We never had a punt blocked.

--In addition to having punts blocked, probably the more common scenario in youth ball is the bad snap to the punter.  Next most common mistake?  Punting to their fast guy.  Kick...the...ball...out...of...bounds.

We are better than most teams on KO and KR. Our PAT kick needs to improve or we just need to go for 1 (run/pass for PAT). Snap is good 90% of the time. Hold is good 80% of the time. Kick is good 10% of the time. So if we don't have someone emerge as a kicker, we'll scrap it. I have no idea how to coach up a kicker.

--If kicking an XP is worth 2 points, then it's worth your while to at least find a soccer kid.  Hitting 50% of your kicks will score you more points than running/passing 99% of your XPs.  I can't tell you the number of close games we had where the kicking game made the difference for us over the years:  We score 3 TDs, opponent scores 3 TDs.  We kick 3 XPs.  They don't convert any.  We win by a touchdown, 24-18, instead of risking the game in overtime.

I don't think we have a holding problem. I honestly think we have a ref problem. I might give you a call about the X-man blocking. 

--EVERYONE has a ref problem.  But we DON'T have a holding problem.  You should call me anyway.  At least to say hello, if nothing else. ? 

--Dave

 

"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

The Mission Statement: "I want to show any young man that he is far tougher than he thinks, that he can accomplish more than what he dreamed and that his work ethic will take him wherever he wants to go."

#BattleReady newhope


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Dimson
(@dimson)
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Topic starter  
Posted by: @coachdp
Posted by: @dimson
 
I don't disagree with you the offenses could be better. I am just glad I don't have to face a coordinator/ HC like you in our league.
 
--No, no, no Chris.  You should always want to face the best competition you can.  You don't get better by lowering the bar.  You get better by being not accepting of your own status quo, whatever that may be.  Raise your own bar. 
I would love to raise our bar but then I hear things like they are bigger than us, they are older than us. When in reality it is more, they executed better than us, they blocked better than us, they tackled better than us, they were more deciplined than us.
 
I don't know if the over all talent is down or it is bad coaching but our most dominate team in our age group only averaged 19 points.
 
--Even if "the over all talent is down," then isn't that the case for everyone?  Or are you the exception?
Our league lost numbers due to canceling our season last year. There were leagues that kept playing and they kept those kids instead of them coming back to our league. One of our biggest and most winningest organizations folded because they lost most of their kids to PW.
 
 
Now they did have some big games but the also had a game or two where they only scored 6.
 
--If they won those games, that means they were 6-0 wins.  In youth ball, since the majority of starters are two-way players, the quality of your offense should be equal to the quality of your defense.  A 6-0 win tells me that the defense was good, but the offense was awful.  How can that be if it's predominantly the same personnel?  OR, it means that the winning team's offense was awful and the losing team's offense was even worse.  And that's the issue I see more than 90% of the time.  
 
--I'll refer back to my friend who is one win away from going to Florida for the national championship.  He lost one game this year, 6-0.  The other games he won and won big.  Not because he has a dominant team, but because his opposition has been terrible.  I've been to his practice, and he has solid kids.  They're not superior athletes, but they listen well and play hard.  He could have won that game just by better execution on his part.  (I've watched it on Hudl several times and we've talked about it.)  His opponent didn't beat him.  He simply lost it on his own.
Their defense is pretty solid. We had the same personel on both sides of the ball as we only had at most 15 kids all year. 
 
 
Our biggest issue in my opinion is we focused way too much on conditioning compared to execution of the offense. 
 
--Another common mistake, if your conditioning is lasting longer than 10-12 minutes, or you're running mindless laps. ("Don't be last!")  Keep in mind that most coaches (particularly at the youth level) are just trying to find ways to FILL a 2-hour practice, so "conditioning" (which doesn't really make you any stronger, or even in "better condition") as it pertains to the drills usually used (jumping jacks, pushups, grass pulls, stretching...) serves as an excellent time-filler/waster in much the same way that scrimmaging does.  That being said, I probably condition more than any youth team and probably more so than many high school teams (outside of the weight room), but ours is for mental conditioning/Mojo development.
Our issue is we practiced at a field without lights and so our 15 minutes of conditioning took up a bigger percentage of our practices because we didn't get a full 2 hours. Plus there was no real practice plan after stretching warm ups and suicides were done. We usually either blocked or tackled or ran some random drills. Never went over a blocking scheme, as I said earlier, we were just a block somebody team. We never attempted to evolve the offense and was just a grab bag of poorly executed plays. Defense we ran a version of the Killer Bee and as long as the kids didn't bight on fakes, it held up pretty well. We finsihed near the middle in points given up. 
The other issue was relying on one player to do all the scoring and not doing a proper job of developing our other offensive talent.
 
--And that's just short-sightedness (i.e., bad coaching).  An offense (even one that relies primarily on the running game) still needs to be as diverse as possible.  Not just to give you more scoring options, but so you aren't so heavily invested in one single cog of the entire machine.  If you lose that player due to injury, then you've gone from one-dimensional to non-dimensional.
I told the HC over and over teams would eventually sell out to stop our QB and they did in our play off game which is why bootleg no longer worked. We had some kids with talent and speed but they weren't used properly as our offense was pretty much 2 -3 plays and didn't utilize our team speed like it could have. 
 
We had the talent, we just were not able to utilize it properly. 
 
--And that's my point, exactly.
 
It was frustrating to watch to say the least. 
 
--Oh, I can't imagine myself coaching with him.
 
--Dave
He was a great coach when it came to admin stuff and dealign with the parents. Great year on that front. It was just the practice and gameplan stuff I had issues with. 
 
 

 

 

 


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CoachDP
(@coachdp)
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Joined: 12 years ago
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Posted by: @dimson
I would love to raise our bar but then I hear things like they are bigger than us, they are older than us. When in reality it is more, they executed better than us, they blocked better than us, they tackled better than us, they were more deciplined than us.
 
--You know who pays attention to that?  Kids.  "They're bigger/faster/meaner than us...etc."  That's kid stuff.  You have no control over what your opponent does. You have almost complete control over what you do.  If you're merely "solid" as a coach, then you'll already have a huge advantage over most of your competition.  I'll give you an example:  There's not a team on this planet that runs Wedge better than us.  That not a coach on this planet who coaches Wedge better than I do.  Now the REALITY is that there are other teams that run it better than us and who coach it better than I do.  But even so, Wedge is still a strength of our team EVEN THOUGH THERE ARE OTHERS WHO DO IT BETTER.  Toss is a strength, XX is a strength, X-Men is a strength, aggression is a strength, special teams is a strength...my point is, regardless of how well the competition does things, we're very good at doing any number of things.  And that's what makes us hard to beat.  We can be beat.  It's just going to be tough to do so.
 
Our league lost numbers due to canceling our season last year. There were leagues that kept playing and they kept those kids instead of them coming back to our league. One of our biggest and most winningest organizations folded because they lost most of their kids to PW.
 
--"Our league?"  Does that mean the team(s) in your org, or all those in your conference that compete against each other?
Our issue is we practiced at a field without lights and so our 15 minutes of conditioning took up a bigger percentage of our practices because we didn't get a full 2 hours.
 
--Then rent lights, or have shorter practices/more nights.  In Pop Warner, we're limited to 6 hours per week.  Most teams use that as a 2-hour practice/3 nights per week.  In 2018, we went 90 minutes, 4 nights per week.  MUCH more productive.
 
Plus there was no real practice plan
 
--Then lights (or the lack of them) aren't your problem.
 
--Then lights (or the lack of them) aren't your problem.
 
--Then lights (or the lack of them) aren't your problem.
 
--Did you hear me? 
 
--Chris, how successful do you really expect to be if your time isn't planned out?  Because I can promise you, there's some nutty guy out there right now who takes this very seriously and he plans it out down to the minute, emails the plan the night before, and reviews it with the staff before practice begins.  And he's done pretty well....
after stretching warm ups and suicides were done.
 
stretching and suicides...m'kay.
 
We usually either blocked or tackled or ran some random drills. Never went over a blocking scheme, as I said earlier, we were just a block somebody team. We never attempted to evolve the offense and was just a grab bag of poorly executed plays. Defense we ran a version of the Killer Bee and as long as the kids didn't bight on fakes, it held up pretty well. We finsihed near the middle in points given up. 
 
--Near the middle?  Imagine what could be accomplished if your header had a clue...

 

 

I told the HC over and over teams would eventually sell out to stop our QB and they did in our play off game which is why bootleg no longer worked.
 
--Bootleg, while a good, legitimate play, is a "fooled ya!" play.  I love misdirection, but you'll only go so far fooling defenses.  Once you don't, you'll need to rely on fundamentals.
 
He was a great coach when it came to admin stuff and dealign with the parents. 
 
--That's not a coach.  That's an administrator.  While admin and dealing with parents is important, he's still responsible for coaching the players.
 
--Dave

"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

The Mission Statement: "I want to show any young man that he is far tougher than he thinks, that he can accomplish more than what he dreamed and that his work ethic will take him wherever he wants to go."

#BattleReady newhope


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gumby_in_co
(@gumby_in_co)
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Joined: 12 years ago
Posts: 4768
 
Posted by: @coachdp
Posted by: @gumby_in_co

--You're the header, Lar.  Why argue? 

Complicated answer, simple solution. I either accept it or change it. After 1 season as HC, I'm opting for the latter. 

 

--Good luck playing ball control.  I really hope you'll do it.  Teams just aren't set up to deal with that approach to football, especially youth coaches.  I've said it before, the typical youth football scoring sequence goes something like this:

1st & 10: No gain.

2nd & 10: Fumble, no gain.

3rd & 10: Gain negated by penalty.

3rd & 17 (down replayed): Snap goes over head for 10-yard loss.

4th & 27: Fast kid gets outside while Cornerbacks are lined up inside the Linebackers.  Ball-carrier runs 72 yards for a touchdown. 

It's in my football DNA. I prefer the wide open stuff Mahonz and I did with our older group.  It's just not appropriate for our current group. Next season will be my very first opportunity to run the double wing 100% MY way. It feels like I'm getting back together with my HS girlfriend. Barring a newcomer who is wired the same way, Troy and I will be the only 2 teams using this approach. Troy's victories against 2 of the top 5 teams and his near victories against the other 2 showed me the light. We are not as good as Troy's team . . . yet. But, we can certainly move up the ladder using this philosophy.

I have used every tool in my coaching kit to fix the snaps. 4 straight seasons of not being able to train a competent and consistent snapper. Even the one we "discovered" late in the season had at least 1 and often 2 bad snaps in each of our 3 playoff games. No more. 

--It can be done.  You have two options: Learn how to teach it, or just don't do it. 

I choose the latter. Too much time wasted. Too many drives killed. Too much frustration. I've been trying to learn how to do it for 4 seasons. Time to flush this turd.

We never had a punt blocked.

--In addition to having punts blocked, probably the more common scenario in youth ball is the bad snap to the punter.  Next most common mistake?  Punting to their fast guy.  Kick...the...ball...out...of...bounds.

We punt out of Beast and most teams assume we are going for it so don't even put a guy back. We do 3 perfect punts every day, which means we do between 3 and 6 punts per day, LOL. We aim to kick out of bounds on every punt and it is our QB who does the punting. I'd rather have a guy with confidence and experience with the ball in his hands, even if other kids can punt further. I have 4 big kids ask me every day if they can punt, or show me how far they can punt. First, it takes them 3 tries to not screw it up. Second, "Are you crazy? You NEVER catch snaps and if you ever touch the football, somebody has messed up big time." It will be interesting to see if we can punt out of Beast under center.

 

We are better than most teams on KO and KR. Our PAT kick needs to improve or we just need to go for 1 (run/pass for PAT). Snap is good 90% of the time. Hold is good 80% of the time. Kick is good 10% of the time. So if we don't have someone emerge as a kicker, we'll scrap it. I have no idea how to coach up a kicker.

--If kicking an XP is worth 2 points, then it's worth your while to at least find a soccer kid.  Hitting 50% of your kicks will score you more points than running/passing 99% of your XPs.  I can't tell you the number of close games we had where the kicking game made the difference for us over the years:  We score 3 TDs, opponent scores 3 TDs.  We kick 3 XPs.  They don't convert any.  We win by a touchdown, 24-18, instead of risking the game in overtime.

Had a good phone call today with my scrimmage buddy. He gave me some great insights as to why we can't hit PATs. Chiefly, our holder does not consistently hold the ball the same way. It's often tilted, etc. Second, our kicker is in too much of a hurry and gets there too soon. Sometimes, he kicks before the ball touches the block, which means he tops the ball, which means he kicks it low.

I don't think we have a holding problem. I honestly think we have a ref problem. I might give you a call about the X-man blocking. 

--EVERYONE has a ref problem.  But we DON'T have a holding problem.  You should call me anyway.  At least to say hello, if nothing else. ? 

--Dave

I will take you up on that for sure. We had an amazing Mojo year. I think our Mojo score was 38-2 in 11 games, although 25 of those points came against 3 teams.

 

 

When in doot . . . glass and oot.


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CoachDP
(@coachdp)
Kryptonite
Joined: 12 years ago
Posts: 18111
 
Posted by: @gumby_in_co
 
Troy's victories against 2 of the top 5 teams and his near victories against the other 2 showed me the light. 
 
--Oh, brother.....  "Troy this!"  "Troy that!"  Blah, blah, bloppity blah.  "Troy, Troy, Troy!"  I've been yelling stuff at you for a decade and Troy comes along and beats your butt and now you've seen the light?

 

I choose the latter. Too much time wasted. Too many drives killed. Too much frustration. I've been trying to learn how to do it for 4 seasons. Time to flush this turd.

--I'm coaching all of the Special Teams, this year.  We don't have any (what I would call "natural") kickers.  Can they kick it through?  Yes.  Takes a good snap, good hold, good blocking and a good kick.  Kicking XPs is an EDD.  We have 2 kickers that compete against each other.  I've gone through 3 Centers (I finally got the Powers That Be to allow me to use the Center of my choice).  It's work, and even though it hasn't made a difference in our regular season, I expect it will in our post-season.

 

We punt out of Beast and most teams assume we are going for it so don't even put a guy back. We do 3 perfect punts every day, which means we do between 3 and 6 punts per day, LOL.

--That's the great thing about doing anything perfectly for X number of times.  You'll always get even more reps.  And if you don't, it's because you've achieved perfection.

It will be interesting to see if we can punt out of Beast under center.

We punted out of DTDW many times.  Looks just like Power.  WB goes in motion, takes the Toss and rugby kicks it down field.  Never a return man there when we did it.  And since the defense's back was to the football after it was kicked, we could get downfield and beat them to it, downing the ball.

 

Had a good phone call today with my scrimmage buddy. He gave me some great insights as to why we can't hit PATs. Chiefly, our holder does not consistently hold the ball the same way. It's often tilted, etc. Second, our kicker is in too much of a hurry and gets there too soon. Sometimes, he kicks before the ball touches the block, which means he tops the ball, which means he kicks it low.

--See what you can get from just one phone call? ? 

--Dave

"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

The Mission Statement: "I want to show any young man that he is far tougher than he thinks, that he can accomplish more than what he dreamed and that his work ethic will take him wherever he wants to go."

#BattleReady newhope


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gumby_in_co
(@gumby_in_co)
Platinum
Joined: 12 years ago
Posts: 4768
 
Posted by: @coachdp
Posted by: @gumby_in_co
 
Troy's victories against 2 of the top 5 teams and his near victories against the other 2 showed me the light. 
 
--Oh, brother.....  "Troy this!"  "Troy that!"  Blah, blah, bloppity blah.  "Troy, Troy, Troy!"  I've been yelling stuff at you for a decade and Troy comes along and beats your butt and now you've seen the light?
 
Nah. Troy beats my butt every year. Nothing new there. It's the fact that he beat a stacked top flight team, then another stacked top flight team by depriving them of the ball.

 

I choose the latter. Too much time wasted. Too many drives killed. Too much frustration. I've been trying to learn how to do it for 4 seasons. Time to flush this turd.

--I'm coaching all of the Special Teams, this year.  We don't have any (what I would call "natural") kickers.  Can they kick it through?  Yes.  Takes a good snap, good hold, good blocking and a good kick.  Kicking XPs is an EDD.  We have 2 kickers that compete against each other.  I've gone through 3 Centers (I finally got the Powers That Be to allow me to use the Center of my choice).  It's work, and even though it hasn't made a difference in our regular season, I expect it will in our post-season.

Was talking about shotgun snap above. Done. Moving on.

 

We punt out of Beast and most teams assume we are going for it so don't even put a guy back. We do 3 perfect punts every day, which means we do between 3 and 6 punts per day, LOL.

--That's the great thing about doing anything perfectly for X number of times.  You'll always get even more reps.  And if you don't, it's because you've achieved perfection.

It will be interesting to see if we can punt out of Beast under center.

We punted out of DTDW many times.  Looks just like Power.  WB goes in motion, takes the Toss and rugby kicks it down field.  Never a return man there when we did it.  And since the defense's back was to the football after it was kicked, we could get downfield and beat them to it, downing the ball.

Ah yes. Forgot all about Toss Punt. Even better.

 

 

 

When in doot . . . glass and oot.


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gumby_in_co
(@gumby_in_co)
Platinum
Joined: 12 years ago
Posts: 4768
 
Posted by: @coachdp
 
--Another common mistake, if your conditioning is lasting longer than 10-12 minutes, or you're running mindless laps. ("Don't be last!")  Keep in mind that most coaches (particularly at the youth level) are just trying to find ways to FILL a 2-hour practice, so "conditioning" (which doesn't really make you any stronger, or even in "better condition") as it pertains to the drills usually used (jumping jacks, pushups, grass pulls, stretching...) serves as an excellent time-filler/waster in much the same way that scrimmaging does.  That being said, I probably condition more than any youth team and probably more so than many high school teams (outside of the weight room), but ours is for mental conditioning/Mojo development.
 
 

 

 

My scrimmage buddy was challenged by one of his ACs about running Sharks and Minnows at the end of practice. "Aren't we a little old to be doing this." Scrimmage buddy replied, "They just ran sprints for 20 minutes with a big smile on their face and didn't even realize they were conditioning."

My counter to him is that I run Circle of Iron. It is meant to be miserable and tough and uncomfortable and intense. It is meant to suck. My players KNOW they are conditioning. Some even cry as soon as I say, "Give me a big circle". Yet, they finish. Somewhere around the middle of the season, when I got away from running it, I get requests for it, or "Can we do Circle of Iron today?" In our championship game, one of my players asked if we could do Circle of Iron after the game. In fact, it was the kid whose mom emailed me about it being unfair or whatever (bitg misunderstanding). Point is, no one has ever been proud to finish a round of Sharks and Minnows and it has never made anyone mentally tougher.

I've had a few parents comment about they love Circle of Iron because it "gets them in shape". I explain that the goal of Circle of Iron is not to get them in shape (that's a side benefit), but to get them comfortable with being uncomfortable. To show them that limits are what YOU decide they are.

To condition, we play football. Makes sense to me that if you want to be in condition to play football . . . play football. Whether it's drills or team, have them do what they are going to do on the football field. 

Warmups? Zach is the man. He suggested that we use form tackling as a warm up. Freaking brilliant. Then, what's really cool is when I tell them, "You can figure it out. Do some form tackling for 10 minutes to warm up". Watching them take ownership of that is a great moment. Why stop there? "Okay, now go through Special Teams." Nobody likes being told what to do, especially when they know what to do.

When in doot . . . glass and oot.


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Bob Goodman
(@bob-goodman)
Diamond
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 9727
 
Posted by: @gumby_in_co

I don't think we have a holding problem. I honestly think we have a ref problem. I might give you a call about the X-man blocking. 

--EVERYONE has a ref problem.

Let me tell you about the one in last Saturday's game.  We're behind and being shut out, but driving inside their 20 with little time left in the half.  4th and goal, our QB on waggle gets his face mask grabbed but continues downfield on a pretty good run before going down.  Officials penalize half the distance to the goal line from the end of the run -- so far, so good -- but then count the down so the ball is turned over!


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CoachDP
(@coachdp)
Kryptonite
Joined: 12 years ago
Posts: 18111
 
Posted by: @gumby_in_co
 
Scrimmage buddy replied, "They just ran sprints for 20 minutes with a big smile on their face and didn't even realize they were conditioning."
 
--They just wasted 20 minutes..."Conditioning?"  It's just laughable.  It's not that they're too old for "Sharks and Minnows."  It that "Sharks and Minnows" doesn't do anything for making them better.
 
My counter to him is that I run Circle of Iron. It is meant to be miserable and tough and uncomfortable and intense. It is meant to suck.
 
--Exactly.  Build in a toughness and resolve at age level where most kids have neither.
 
Point is, no one has ever been proud to finish a round of Sharks and Minnows and it has never made anyone mentally tougher.
 
--This ^.
 
I've had a few parents comment about they love Circle of Iron because it "gets them in shape". I explain that the goal of Circle of Iron is not to get them in shape (that's a side benefit), but to get them comfortable with being uncomfortable. To show them that limits are what YOU decide they are.
 
--It doesn't get anyone in shape.  It's just 10-15 minutes of emotional and physical discomfort, stress and intensity. (LTHS)  Fat kids are still fat.  Weak kids are still weak.  However, ALL kids are mentally tougher so they'll work harder.  And they learn where the bar is set and that they can meet the demand.  Parents are confusing confidence and motivation for "getting in shape."
 
Makes sense to me that if you want to be in condition to play football . . . play football. Whether it's drills or team, have them do what they are going to do on the football field. 
 
--Radical concept, but you may be on to something here.

He suggested that we use form tackling as a warm up. Freaking brilliant.

--Absolutely nothing wrong with that.  The most important thing is to know W H Y you are using that specific warmup.  I spend a lot of time teaching form running, so my warmups include sprints, backwards sprints, butt kickers and high knees.  We use those because we can incorporate form running into each of them.  Most coaches have no idea why they're doing the warmups they've chosen (and I can tell by what they're doing).  But if you ask, you'll usually get some vagaries as "It's what the high school does," "That's what we did when I played," etc.

--Dave

 

 

 

"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

The Mission Statement: "I want to show any young man that he is far tougher than he thinks, that he can accomplish more than what he dreamed and that his work ethic will take him wherever he wants to go."

#BattleReady newhope


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