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Offensive system help.

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angalton
(@angalton)
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Joined: 9 years ago
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Wishbone with dive, blast, smash, power, and trap with play action passing.

The greatest accomplishment is not in never failing, but in rising again after you fail.


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CoachDP
(@coachdp)
Kryptonite
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 17889
 

Honestly, I cant get any help coaching it and I am struggling because my other coaches dont like it.

They don't know any better.

You have the wrong coaches.  As has been said many times, success isn't about scheme.  It's about execution.  If you aren't successful running the Double Wing, the only offense you should be changing to is the one you have more knowledge of how to teach.  If the other coaches aren't on board, fire them or let them coach defense.  It's youth ball.  Your system (if you're going to be successful) is going to be based on a ground-based attack.  If you're running Power, Counter, Trap and Sweep, would they rather you run it from the I?  From a Wishbone set?  And does it even make a difference?  It shouldn't. 

The long and the short of it is this:  your staff is complaining about the wrong thing.  Success isn't found in scheme.  It's found in execution.  If you aren't successful with the Double Wing, it's because you can't run or block.  Changing to another ground-based attack doesn't change this.

Instead of people complaining about "boring," they should get better at teaching fundamentals.  But I'll bet that's boring, too. ::)

--Dave

"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

The Mission Statement: "I want to show any young man that he is far tougher than he thinks, that he can accomplish more than what he dreamed and that his work ethic will take him wherever he wants to go."

#BattleReady newhope


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jrk5150
(@jrk5150)
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Joined: 12 years ago
Posts: 6431
 

I would be interested in hearing what they have to say.  Unfortunately, my guess is that actually listening to them will drive your team into the ground. The situation you describe fits SW or DW, and their resistance pretty much shows they have no clue.

That said, you can still pull quite a bit from offenses like the SW/DW into other formations that will "trick" idiots like that into thinking they're running something other than SW/DW.  The magic of those two offenses pertaining to talent issues comes from two main aspects:

1. Football in a phone booth mitigates talent disadvantages, especially around speed. Doesn't matter how fast or athletic you are in a phone booth, there's no space to use it.

2. They are fully fleshed out systems that are proven on grass, with ready made core plays and complements so that your learning curve is minimized.

You can still use the principles of the offenses that bring those two things to the table while running something that doesn't necessarily look like DW (for example).  I've been doing stuff that looks more Wing T than DW for years, but I still think the way my offense works is more analogous to the DW when it comes down to it. But I will also own that my offense is likely less effective than pure DW, so I have made compromises for sure.


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CoachDP
(@coachdp)
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Joined: 11 years ago
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Wishbone with dive, blast, smash, power, and trap with play action passing.

You can't do that in the Double Wing?

--Dave

"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

The Mission Statement: "I want to show any young man that he is far tougher than he thinks, that he can accomplish more than what he dreamed and that his work ethic will take him wherever he wants to go."

#BattleReady newhope


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jrk5150
(@jrk5150)
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Joined: 12 years ago
Posts: 6431
 

Dave, sometimes you have to pick your battles.

Sometimes that means it's your way or the highway, sure.

But sometimes you can still accomplish (most of) what you want to with a little bit of massaging others' egos.


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CoachDP
(@coachdp)
Kryptonite
Joined: 11 years ago
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I am trying to find an offense that is good for smaller players with out much talent or speed.

Then I'm not sure you really understand what the Double Wing offers.

--Dave

"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

The Mission Statement: "I want to show any young man that he is far tougher than he thinks, that he can accomplish more than what he dreamed and that his work ethic will take him wherever he wants to go."

#BattleReady newhope


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Coach Correa
(@coach-correa)
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Joined: 7 years ago
Posts: 1592
 

They don't know any better.

You have the wrong coaches.  As has been said many times, success isn't about scheme.  It's about execution.  If you aren't successful running the Double Wing, the only offense you should be changing to is the one you have more knowledge of how to teach.  If the other coaches aren't on board, fire them or let them coach defense.  It's youth ball.  Your system (if you're going to be successful) is going to be based on a ground-based attack.  If you're running Power, Counter, Trap and Sweep, would they rather you run it from the I?  From a Wishbone set?  And does it even make a difference?  It shouldn't. 

The long and the short of it is this:  your staff is complaining about the wrong thing.  Success isn't found in scheme.  It's found in execution.  If you aren't successful with the Double Wing, it's because you can't run or block.  Changing to another ground-based attack doesn't change this.

Instead of people complaining about "boring," they should get better at teaching fundamentals.  But I'll bet that's boring, too ::)

--Dave

Great Point DP .....

Head Coach Tito Correa New Britain Raiders 14-U


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CoachDP
(@coachdp)
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Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 17889
 

But sometimes you can still accomplish (most of) what you want to with a little bit of massaging others' egos.

Yes, sometimes.  But when a staff has little idea of what they're complaining about (and I don't care that they don't like the offense, because their lack of success isn't based on scheme) I can't take them seriously.  And then it doesn't really matter if they're happy, they still don't have a clue.

It's like when parents yell from the stands about calling "a stupid play."  There are no stupid plays.  Every play drawn up in a real offense works.  But it doesn't work if there's not proper execution of it.

--Dave

"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

The Mission Statement: "I want to show any young man that he is far tougher than he thinks, that he can accomplish more than what he dreamed and that his work ethic will take him wherever he wants to go."

#BattleReady newhope


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angalton
(@angalton)
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Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 2552
 

You can't do that in the Double Wing?

Yes, yes you can. I totally agree on your above post. Execution is everything and starts with the most simple function of the game.  ( Blocking and tackling ). If he is that concerned about the O, I am more concerned with his D.

The greatest accomplishment is not in never failing, but in rising again after you fail.


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blockandtackle
(@coacharnold)
Silver
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 847
 

Funny how it seems to be "More Fun" watching footballs fly through the air, even when the QB and Receivers are not up to the caliber required to do so. 

If you let everyone else dictate you might as well let them be the Header.

Nothing is less fun than going 5/30 for 4 yards and 5 INTs.  A terrible spread offense is one of the most soul sucking things a coach can force upon his team.

People think it's all fun until they actually try to throw the ball around without the means to make it work.  It's like buying a new Corvette when you work at McDonalds: it's fun to think about until you realize you won't even have the gas money to take it out of the driveway.


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mahonz
(@mahonz)
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Joined: 12 years ago
Posts: 23171
 

Honestly, I cant get any help coaching it and I am struggling because my other coaches dont like it.

Odd. So they stand there arms folded and brood while you coach the O by yourself?

What is beautiful, lives forever.


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parone
(@parone)
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Joined: 6 years ago
Posts: 766
 

As has been said many times, success isn't about scheme.  It's about execution. DP

that quote really says it all.

you know what offense nobody talks about much these days?  the veer.  we all know that our offenses owe a lot to the veer or at the least share core principles with it.  but the veer is so 1980.  under center, nothing fancy, no new concepts.  blah...right?

one quick thing though.  you know who has run and continues to run the veer?  a team called De La Salle out in California.  look them up if you've never heard of them.

if your execution is good you can run almost anything, as long as it is sound. 

we all love scheme.  but you can't scheme your way to a good season.  practices should be 10% scheme and 90% fundamentals/execution.

Dream Big.  Work Hard. Stay Humble.


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Coach Correa
(@coach-correa)
Gold
Joined: 7 years ago
Posts: 1592
 

As has been said many times, success isn't about scheme.  It's about execution. DP

that quote really says it all.

you know what offense nobody talks about much these days?  the veer.  we all know that our offenses owe a lot to the veer or at the least share core principles with it.  but the veer is so 1980.  under center, nothing fancy, no new concepts.  blah...right?

one quick thing though.  you know who has run and continues to run the veer?  a team called De La Salle out in California.  look them up if you've never heard of them.

if your execution is good you can run almost anything, as long as it is sound. 

we all love scheme.  but you can't scheme your way to a good season.  practices should be 10% scheme and 90% fundamentals/execution.

Speak On good brother Coach and Teach what you know they all work if your a real FOOTBALL COACH.

Head Coach Tito Correa New Britain Raiders 14-U


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blockandtackle
(@coacharnold)
Silver
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 847
 

As has been said many times, success isn't about scheme.  It's about execution. DP

that quote really says it all.

you know what offense nobody talks about much these days?  the veer.  we all know that our offenses owe a lot to the veer or at the least share core principles with it.  but the veer is so 1980.  under center, nothing fancy, no new concepts.  blah...right?

one quick thing though.  you know who has run and continues to run the veer?  a team called De La Salle out in California.  look them up if you've never heard of them.

if your execution is good you can run almost anything, as long as it is sound. 

we all love scheme.  but you can't scheme your way to a good season.  practices should be 10% scheme and 90% fundamentals/execution.

Not just De La Salle.  It seems like every state has at least 1 or 2 teams running the SBV to the final 4 every year.  JT Curtis, Mt. Carmel, etc.  Watch the championship games in your state and you'll likely see that one of the teams is running it.

Fans still gripe, even as the teams collect rack up the hardware year after year.  A lot of them would rather go 3-7 running whatever's lighting things up on TV than go 14-0 running "that same up the middle play that don't work anymore" to a championship.


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CoachCalande
(@www-coachcalande-com)
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Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 7059
 

Do. It. Your. Way.

Tune. Out. The. Static.

MOJO    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gtcRmKnRcsA

Go to WWW.COACHCALANDE.COM  for Double Wing DVDs, Playbook, Drills Manuals, Practice footage and emagazines. Ask me about our new 38 special dvds!


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