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Have we been teaching catching "wrong" this whole time?  

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somecoach
(@coach-tony)
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May 9, 2017 7:59 pm  

Here me out on this one.

With spring ball around the corner I have been given the task of coaching the receivers and have been putting together a practice plan that includes many Catching Drills.

During my usual binge watching of youtube videos I came across the "NFL Redzone touchdown montage of the week" series.

After watching week 1 for whatever reason it occurred to me that there wasn't as much "diamond" style catching. Many balls were caught in a "bowl of soup" fashion.

As far as I can remember, every single time someone was being taught how to catch a football, the coaching point was always "make a diamond with your hands and look the ball in, only go with the 'bowl of soup' if it is too low... if you 'bowl of soup' it too high it will bounce off your pads" and the coach/parent teaching the kid would emphasize that the kid using the "Diamond" for every catch for the rest of the session.

So i decided to re watch the video and make a tally of all TD catches being made.
I split the types of catches into 3 classes.

1. "Diamond"- any catch that involved the typical thumb-to-thumb index-to-index diamond alignment of the hands
2. "Bowl of Soup" only catches that involve the receiver being face to face with the Q and he catches the ball with the elbows at his side and palms up (no diamond)
3. "over the shoulder" a bowl of soup catch except the receiver was in stride with his back/side towards the Q.

After finishing week 1, Diamond catches were roughly 1/3 of the catches
So to confirm my hunch I continued through and finished week 5.

The results:
Total Passing TDs- 242
Diamond- 72 (29.8%)
Bowl of Soup- 80 (33%)
Over the Shoulder- 90 (37.2%)

Now I know there are a good amount of deep balls when looking at TD's; but there was a good amount of shorter routes as well. Maybe I should look for a bigger and diverse sample size, but 242 plays seemed like enough to at least start a convo on here about it.

In no way am I saying to eliminate the practice of Diamond style catching, but from looking at these statistics, I think this spring/season I should emphasis over the shoulder/bowl style catching... or at least put less of an emphasis on the diamond

After all when you look at a teams typical "route tree" you can almost always get away with bowl catching for majority of it:
Deep routes such as the Go, Post, and Corner are to be hit in stride and Over the Shoulder.
The comeback and curl could be caught as a diamond, but due to the nature of the routes the ball is "under thrown" and could require the receiver to go for the Bowl.
Outs are over the shoulder catches
Slants and Spots are borderline depending on how accurate the Q is
Screens are the same way

It seems that the only times a Diamond style catch is MANDATORY is when someone is taking a snap, or a jump/contested ball; situation.

I just figured I would share this and see what you guys think.


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mahonz
(@mahonz)
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May 10, 2017 6:13 am  

Interesting.

I guess the common coaching point for any catch should still be never let the football get into your body.

What is beautiful, lives forever.


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PSLCOACHROB
(@pslcoachrob)
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May 10, 2017 7:08 am  

Looks like it needs about a 3rd of the teaching. Which makes sense but I don't know that just watching tds is a good rep. Many tds are going to be over the shoulder so I think that might slant the stats a bit. Bubbles, slants, comebacks etc. don't score as often but are a huge part of many youth and hs passing attacks.


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parone
(@parone)
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May 10, 2017 7:38 am  

all we emphasize is keeping your eyes on the ball and not letting it get into your pads.  but we REALLY  emphasize that. 

too simplistic?

Dream Big.  Work Hard. Stay Humble.


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somecoach
(@coach-tony)
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May 10, 2017 10:26 am  

Looks like it needs about a 3rd of the teaching. Which makes sense but I don't know that just watching tds is a good rep. Many tds are going to be over the shoulder so I think that might slant the stats a bit. Bubbles, slants, comebacks etc. don't score as often but are a huge part of many youth and hs passing attacks.

I mentioned that above and probably will expand this into a regular games film to see if it holds up.


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PSLCOACHROB
(@pslcoachrob)
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May 10, 2017 11:49 am  

I think it will change some but not a ton. I get your point and it makes sense. I think we did a pretty good job of teaching all 3 methods mentioned. It was always a part of our indie edds for wr and tes. Plus we would hit it some prepractice when we could.


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CoachDP
(@coachdp)
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May 15, 2017 2:14 pm  

I guess the common coaching point for any catch should still be never let the football get into your body.

Well I'm sure that I'm the uncommon one because that's what I teach.

--Dave

"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

The Mission Statement: "I want to show any young man that he is far tougher than he thinks, that he can accomplish more than what he dreamed and that his work ethic will take him wherever he wants to go."

#BattleReady newhope


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Michael
(@michael)
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May 15, 2017 2:54 pm  

I think there are always things that the top people do that most coaches at lower levels aren't teaching.  I think the coaches that try to learn why these things are being done, and how they might be able to apply them beneficially, do a lot better than the coaches who say things like, "Well, if you're Jonathan Ogden, you can get away with doing it wrong."

Paul Alexander (the O-Line coach of the Bengals) usually has a few really good comments about this sort of thing when he talks about "low hands" on pass pro.

I always find it hilarious, when I am talking to a coach from a lower level, in either of my sports, having it explained to me why something I'm doing works at my level but won't at theirs, when it worked for me at their level and at levels below theirs.

Michael can not receive PM's, emails or respond to Posts. He passed away in September 2018. To honor his contributions we are leaving his account active. R.I.P - Dumcoach Staff.


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Michael
(@michael)
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May 15, 2017 2:56 pm  

Of course, some things are a Bracelet Play:

https://books.google.com/books?id=9AcmtATOK18C&pg=PA248&dq=%22bracelet+play%22+killer&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjOq9ak__LTAhXCq1QKHaz0DRsQ6AEIJjAA#v=onepage&q=%22bracelet%20play%22%20killer&f=false

Michael can not receive PM's, emails or respond to Posts. He passed away in September 2018. To honor his contributions we are leaving his account active. R.I.P - Dumcoach Staff.


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parone
(@parone)
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May 16, 2017 4:18 am  

if anyone doubts the low hand thing, have them fast slide with their hands at their sides, then with their hands straight out.

they'll see very quickly that they are moving better with their hands down.

then have them rush you with your hands straight out-let them grab your arms or rip vs a stationary set of arms.

then let them try it with your hands down and you shooting your hands into them.

that should pretty much end it.

or i guess you could just send them some tape of anthony munoz.

Dream Big.  Work Hard. Stay Humble.


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Test Account
(@test-account)
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May 16, 2017 12:09 pm  

or i guess you could just send them some tape of anthony munoz.

The answer is always I don't have X, or I cant do X, or I am not x, or something that actually diminishes the person saying it.

Please don't PM or respond to this Member. It is an account for all of the posts from abandoned or banned Member Accounts.


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PSLCOACHROB
(@pslcoachrob)
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May 16, 2017 12:31 pm  

The answer is always I don't have X, or I cant do X, or I am not x, or something that actually diminishes the person saying it.

I think "I can't do X" is a valid and honest answer. I can't teach zone blocking. Maybe one day when I sit down and learn all the intricacies I'll be able to but right now I wouldn't even try. I think that probably wasn't what you were getting at though. I tend to take much of what you write in the wrong way.


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Test Account
(@test-account)
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May 16, 2017 2:00 pm  

I think "I can't do X" is a valid and honest answer. I can't teach zone blocking. Maybe one day when I sit down and learn all the intricacies I'll be able to but right now I wouldn't even try. I think that probably wasn't what you were getting at though. I tend to take much of what you write in the wrong way.

You know you do not know. Not what I was aiming at. That I can respect. I am aiming at the guy who says I don't have what the other guys so I am not going to bother. For example, " I cannot recruit kids like Coach x, so that tactic/strategy x is useless at this level."

Just to be clear, I am not aiming at the guy who says,  "this doesn't fit what I do." Those guys I can respect as well.

Please don't PM or respond to this Member. It is an account for all of the posts from abandoned or banned Member Accounts.


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Bob Goodman
(@bob-goodman)
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May 16, 2017 7:02 pm  

Well I'm sure that I'm the uncommon one because that's what I teach.

Indeed, for low passes, I think that's the most forgiving method.  I don't recall hearing anything about not letting the ball touch your body in the old days.

If you try for the fingers method that they teach now, if you get your hands too low, you have almost as little chance of catching the ball as if you get your hands too high.  However, if you go for a scoop catch and get your hands too low, you can still trap the ball with your forearms against your body.  Hey, it works for infielders in baseball.  This method also lets you keep your elbows more or less in front of you, presenting less of a target for an opponent (or even a teammate in a crowd situation) to hit from behind you.


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