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parone
(@parone)
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Joined: 5 years ago
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August 6, 2016 4:40 am  

Hey guys. 

I was attending my son's practices this week, and couldn't help but notice that the O line coach was stressing that the linemen should 'not extend your arms' and 'don't use your hand' in pass protection.

This was in contrast to what we've always taught, which was step to the inside, deliver a strike to the defender-preventing him from grabbing and getting control of you, move your feet, readjust, never giving up inside leverage.  We drilled this into our players for 4 years, and had very good success in pass protection, even though we only passed 3 or 4 times a game.  my son's coach's main point though, is to not use arms/hands, and this is a direct quote, 'just get in the way...'

I'm honestly asking if this is a valid technique that I am totally ignorant of.  Do any of you guys teach your O linemen to basically keep their hands within one inch of the chest plate in pass pro?  If i was coaching against this, i'd teach my d line to explode, grab their chest plate at arms length and shed them, and i feel strongly it would work.

It is in such contrast to what we did that 4 of my former players, as well as my son, have come up to me and asked me about it.  Even though I don't agree with it, I felt like I had to tell them to isten to their coach.  But I added the caveat that, in a game, they should use whatever technique protects their qb best.  I honestly don't know if that was the right thing to say or not.

help me out, i'm confused.

Dream Big.  Work Hard. Stay Humble.


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MHcoach
(@mhcoach)
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Florida
August 6, 2016 5:22 am  

P

Wait , what is telling them? No hands? how do they make contact?

Joe

"Champions behave like champions before they're champions: they have a winning standard of performance before they are winners"Bill Walsh


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Michael
(@michael)
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August 6, 2016 8:03 am  

My centers and guards, when covered, run block it.

Everything else becomes a run block as soon as we get our hands on you.

Michael can not receive PM's, emails or respond to Posts. He passed away in September 2018. To honor his contributions we are leaving his account active. R.I.P - Dumcoach Staff.


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Bob Goodman
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August 6, 2016 9:55 am  

Sheesh, pass pro was the main reason the use of hands on O was liberalized.  Hard to believe not taking advantage of it.  Some coaches prefer extension of hands to stay in contact, feeling the way the defender's moving; other coaches like alternatively shooting the hands to make contact & then withdrawing them to re-establish distance, like a 2-hand jab.

Parone, how does your son's coach teach run blocking?


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Dusty Ol Fart
(@youth-coach)
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August 6, 2016 3:26 pm  

In my book, its no where near a Valid Technique.  Regardless of Punch and Kick, Punch and Kick or Slide.  The objective way more than just get in the way!  I don't really have "Drop Back" passing.  5 step is about as deep as we get and there is movement involved! However, there are indeed teaching points and techniques involved! 

Sound like a "Just Block Somebody" kinda guy!    ::)

Not MPP... ONE TASK!  Teach them!  🙂


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parone
(@parone)
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August 7, 2016 2:00 pm  

Michael, we had a similar set of rules, being a predominantly run based team.

Bob, he does the whole, 'step, load, fire' progression.  I'm ok with that.  I think it's kind of bull, because if you use that exaggerated load, the defender is going to get ahold of your chest and shed you, but at least it makes some sense. 

It sounds like you guys have had similar experience vis a vis the pass blocking thing though.  that's actually disappointing, as i honestly hoped this guy knew something i don't. 

Not sure how to handle the questions from the boys... ???

Dream Big.  Work Hard. Stay Humble.


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parone
(@parone)
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August 7, 2016 2:03 pm  

DoF-he does indeed seem like a  'just block somebody' guy.  Big, heavy, bald guy, seems to try to intimidate the kids by yelling and with his size(he's prob 6-4 300+).  i don't care what size anybody is, honestly, but I'm a firm believer that coaching is more teaching than intimidation.  there doesn't seem to be a lot of teaching going on, but perhaps it'll get better as we go.

that said, the guy is volunteering his time, and i respect that. 

being a coach is hard.

being an ex-coach, it'd seem, is harder...

Dream Big.  Work Hard. Stay Humble.


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Bob Goodman
(@bob-goodman)
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August 7, 2016 7:00 pm  

It sounds like you guys have had similar experience vis a vis the pass blocking thing though.  that's actually disappointing, as i honestly hoped this guy knew something i don't.

I wouldn't dismiss it so quickly.  It reads as if he's teaching pass blocking similarly to stalk blocking.  Perhaps if the passer runs around a lot by choice, then the blocking is in a similar situation to that of a wide receiver who shouldn't commit but needs to read the defender because the blocker doesn't know from moment to moment where the ballcarrier is.  I wouldn't teach such a technique for pass pro if there's any semblance of a pocket, but I'd be open to having him explain to me why he coaches it that way.

I've asked in the past who benefits more from separation: the pass rusher or the blocker.  Looks like this coach thinks the blocker benefits more from the separation.  Ordinarily, though, if I wanted separation while blocking for the passer, I'd use that quick hit-&-retract w the hands.


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defensewins
(@defensewins)
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Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 662
August 8, 2016 10:35 am  

Hey guys. 

I was attending my son's practices this week, and couldn't help but notice that the O line coach was stressing that the linemen should 'not extend your arms' and 'don't use your hand' in pass protection.

This was in contrast to what we've always taught, which was step to the inside, deliver a strike to the defender-preventing him from grabbing and getting control of you, move your feet, readjust, never giving up inside leverage.  We drilled this into our players for 4 years, and had very good success in pass protection, even though we only passed 3 or 4 times a game.  my son's coach's main point though, is to not use arms/hands, and this is a direct quote, 'just get in the way...'

I'm honestly asking if this is a valid technique that I am totally ignorant of.  Do any of you guys teach your O linemen to basically keep their hands within one inch of the chest plate in pass pro?  If i was coaching against this, i'd teach my d line to explode, grab their chest plate at arms length and shed them, and i feel strongly it would work.

It is in such contrast to what we did that 4 of my former players, as well as my son, have come up to me and asked me about it.  Even though I don't agree with it, I felt like I had to tell them to isten to their coach.  But I added the caveat that, in a game, they should use whatever technique protects their qb best.  I honestly don't know if that was the right thing to say or not.

help me out, i'm confused.

Have you asked the coach?  I would in this situation...you asked around, no one has heard of it, etc.  Maybe he has a reason for it...maybe he is a bit inexperienced and guessing...one will never know unless one asks.


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parone
(@parone)
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August 9, 2016 10:32 am  

defense-you are right.  the guy seems pretty unapproachable, but that's prob the right move.  just got to come up with a way to broach the subject that won't sound like a criticism.

Dream Big.  Work Hard. Stay Humble.


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33coach
(@33coach)
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Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 357
September 2, 2016 9:21 am  

ive taught it 3 ways:

Stretch blocking (turn, punch, and drive lateral)
Outside Zone Track Blocking
Punch - Slide

this year we are a Punch - Slide team

now, whether or not to use hands is a debate - many a shoulder blocking team will tell you NO you dont need hands.

also, coach your team - not his. dont try and correct him, thats just disrespectful.

STC & TEs coach - Mission Prep HSNewly Converted member to the Church of Saint Tubby


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blockandtackle
(@coacharnold)
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October 2, 2016 5:42 pm  

Is he an old guy?

The way I see it, there's one of 4 things going on here:

1.  He played back when use of the hands was illegal (pre 1983) or for someone who taught it that way (like a Wing-T purist) and doesn't know any differently.

http://www.bucksweep.com/shoulderblocking.htm

2.  If it's a youth league, they may not allow the use of hands.

3.  He's afraid of the kids getting every pass play called back for holding if they use their hands--I coached with a guy like that once.

4.  He's ignorant of how to coach pass pro.

I've seen more HS coaches than i'd ever imagined who tell their kids to "just go sideways and get in the way" on pass pro.  It works as well as you'd expect.

Personally, I like kick sliding with inside leverage for drop back stuff and simple step, set, hinge for sprint outs.  I feel like they're both simple techniques to teach for all age groups, though I don't know if I'd want to ever even bother with true drop back passing below the MS level due to the kids' lack of coordination.


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Michael
(@michael)
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October 2, 2016 6:27 pm  

We don't do much pass blocking at the younger levels, but I have coached 8th-graders (and have sometimes stayed at a Holiday Inn), and my two main rules for the hands were (a) low hands for the tackles when setting and (b) when the hands get on, they stay on.

The attached picture is Ogden, Williams, Munoz, Pace, Light, Peters, and Anderson.  I look forward to the comments that they could "afford" to do it.  Paul Alexander's clinic talks usually have a good discussion about low hands.  That's where I heard about it.

Michael can not receive PM's, emails or respond to Posts. He passed away in September 2018. To honor his contributions we are leaving his account active. R.I.P - Dumcoach Staff.


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Test Account
(@test-account)
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Posts: 13421
October 2, 2016 6:37 pm  

To me, the technique is the last thing one needs to worry about. Don't get me wrong technique is important.
But when we pass protect, its a jail break for the defense. People come free left and right. And it isn't just us.

Please don't PM or respond to this Member. It is an account for all of the posts from abandoned or banned Member Accounts.


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parone
(@parone)
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Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 766
October 3, 2016 3:43 am  

that's why we stuck with our basic run blocking-that way everyone was accounted for, we stopped their initial charge, and there was no confusion/new scheme for the boys up front.  of course, if we passed more than 3 times a game, that might have not worked...

Dream Big.  Work Hard. Stay Humble.


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