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gumby_in_co
(@gumby_in_co)
Platinum
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 4208
May 8, 2018 9:52 am  

You never experienced what happened in our very first game with mega splits.

We can go back to the shit show if you'd like . It was so bad we changed our cadence at halftime.

Dripping with sarcasm.

When in doot . . . glass and oot.


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mahonz
(@mahonz)
Kryptonite
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 23004
May 8, 2018 9:55 am  

Dripping with sarcasm.

Ditto.

What is beautiful, lives forever.


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ZACH
 ZACH
(@bucksweep58)
Diamond
Joined: 10 years ago
Posts: 9415
Coach
May 8, 2018 9:57 am  

You gotta have rythum, so much so we used a silent count for our last 5 games... now that was hilariously awesome... not one offside or false start...all based on center head nod.

Im curious tho how the snap count effects the blocking in big splits vs littlw splits or at all... this is a legit question and i thought this was all an inside joke which apparently is not haha

I can explain it to you, I can't understand if for you.


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mahonz
(@mahonz)
Kryptonite
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 23004
May 8, 2018 10:25 am  

You gotta have rythum, so much so we used a silent count for our last 5 games... now that was hilariously awesome... not one offside or false start...all based on center head nod.

Im curious tho how the snap count effects the blocking in big splits vs littlw splits or at all... this is a legit question and i thought this was all an inside joke which apparently is not haha

We had issues immediately with LB'rs shooting the gaps almost on a dead run. So no way an OLM could pick it up.

Two options.....go on one and two or kill any type of cadence altogether and go on first sound....or as you did.... a head bob.

With tight splits no one is shooting gaps freely and untouched....for the most part.

I will never forget our first game using mega splits. The cadence was one of those big forehead slap moments. Never dawned on any of us that it would kill our Offense.

What is beautiful, lives forever.


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gumby_in_co
(@gumby_in_co)
Platinum
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 4208
May 8, 2018 10:46 am  

Im curious tho how the snap count effects the blocking in big splits vs littlw splits

For us... defenders timing the snap is a huge problem. We go all in on balance and quickness at the expense of power. Our bigger guys really have to move to pick up smaller guys, so we try to level the playing field. We work with the QBs to vary their timing. I tell the that they snap it as a LB is walking up or the defense is shifting and don’t give the line time to re-identify, then they deserve what they get and the line has my permission to laugh at you.

To say you can’t use a rhythmic cadence is perhaps too specific. You do have to solve the timing issue somehow. Mahonz went with first sound. We have introduced a lot of motion lately and I’m concerned that allows the defense to time us. Mahonz doesn’t think it’s a problem. I need to go back and look at film. If it’s an issue, we’ll get creative and solve it.

When in doot . . . glass and oot.


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ZACH
 ZACH
(@bucksweep58)
Diamond
Joined: 10 years ago
Posts: 9415
Coach
May 8, 2018 11:10 am  

For us... defenders timing the snap is a huge problem. We go all in on balance and quickness at the expense of power. Our bigger guys really have to move to pick up smaller guys, so we try to level the playing field. We work with the QBs to vary their timing. I tell the that they snap it as a LB is walking up or the defense is shifting and don’t give the line time to re-identify, then they deserve what they get and the line has my permission to laugh at you.

To say you can’t use a rhythmic cadence is perhaps too specific. You do have to solve the timing issue somehow. Mahonz went with first sound. We have introduced a lot of motion lately and I’m concerned that allows the defense to time us. Mahonz doesn’t think it’s a problem. I need to go back and look at film. If it’s an issue, we’ll get creative and solve it.

The fancier the back field gets the more pressure on your front. Which is usually not a great balance, talent wise

Our snapcount issues were solved with a keyword...if key word was "go"  the word proceeding that would be the snap. If we wanted on 2 we told the qb to say " on 2, on 2" loud and at the line. This works atleast 2x a game for free 5 yds.  But our "2" is second go...or second round of gibberish

1: Set green 8...go...blue
2: set green 8...go...blue...green set ...go...blue

We always say 1 word before a snap... never first sound...we just never had success... so we go on "color"  just  "go..blue"

Maybe this will help, if my rugby team makes it to club nationals ill be in denver in 3 weeks to talk football with @mahonz just with out a pretty girl this time

I can explain it to you, I can't understand if for you.


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headtrip
(@headtrip)
Bronze
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 292
May 8, 2018 5:30 pm  

Imagine mega splits with multi form offenses lol

ran our "mega" splits with the coco spread in a post season tourney. Went undefeated. Only had two weeks to install with a really rough mix of kids from two teams. Not an all-star team so much as two teams that didn't have enough kids that wanted to go to a thanksgiving weekend football tournament. Didn't do the best job keeping on the line about their splits, but we were wider than what most teams usually see. The kids from the other team kept wanting to tighten their splits.


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Michael
(@michael)
Kryptonite
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 12890
May 8, 2018 5:41 pm  

Jeez, dude. If you've got a point, make it. There might be something to be learned here. You know I'm always open to that, but not if it means wading through neck deep bullshit.

Sometimes the band-aid just has to be ripped off.

And see the wonderful discussion that followed?

Michael can not receive PM's, emails or respond to Posts. He passed away in September 2018. To honor his contributions we are leaving his account active. R.I.P - Dumcoach Staff.


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headtrip
(@headtrip)
Bronze
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 292
May 8, 2018 5:52 pm  

The fancier the back field gets the more pressure on your front. Which is usually not a great balance, talent wise

Our snapcount issues were solved with a keyword...if key word was "go"  the word proceeding that would be the snap. If we wanted on 2 we told the qb to say " on 2, on 2" loud and at the line. This works atleast 2x a game for free 5 yds.  But our "2" is second go...or second round of gibberish

1: Set green 8...go...blue
2: set green 8...go...blue...green set ...go...blue

We always say 1 word before a snap... never first sound...we just never had success... so we go on "color"  just  "go..blue"

Maybe this will help, if my rugby team makes it to club nationals ill be in denver in 3 weeks to talk football with @mahonz just with out a pretty girl this time

We went  "ready...... hit"    Since we used a good bit of motion, ready was just supposed to be to let the offense know to be ready/set, not part of the actual snap count. Our qb turned it into a rythm. I didn't notice it on the field, but when i was watching video, with all of the stuff in between plays cut out, it got really annoying. As soon as i addressed that, we had much less trouble with defenses timing the snap and beating our o-line off the ball.


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mahonz
(@mahonz)
Kryptonite
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 23004
May 8, 2018 8:27 pm  

For us... defenders timing the snap is a huge problem. We go all in on balance and quickness at the expense of power. Our bigger guys really have to move to pick up smaller guys, so we try to level the playing field. We work with the QBs to vary their timing. I tell the that they snap it as a LB is walking up or the defense is shifting and don’t give the line time to re-identify, then they deserve what they get and the line has my permission to laugh at you.

To say you can’t use a rhythmic cadence is perhaps too specific. You do have to solve the timing issue somehow. Mahonz went with first sound. We have introduced a lot of motion lately and I’m concerned that allows the defense to time us. Mahonz doesn’t think it’s a problem. I need to go back and look at film. If it’s an issue, we’ll get creative and solve it.

I believe if motion does present problems we simple introduce different kinds of motion. Jet, Yo-Yo, Orbit, Clear Out.

Then if the D does indeed think they can time it up....they will be right sometimes and in the neutral zone at other times.

The main reason for the first sound was the OLM were already in 2 point stances. So....the QB can sit under center for 10 seconds...1 second....5 seconds....and your OT never gets tired holding a stance.

Initially my concern was will 10 get off the ball fast enough going on first sound. I really haven't noticed that its ever been a problem. Maybe talk to your Group the next few weeks and ask them before they are all off to HS. Plenty have played our style in the Spring and another in the Fall so they would be a great barometer.

What is beautiful, lives forever.


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gumby_in_co
(@gumby_in_co)
Platinum
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 4208
May 8, 2018 9:38 pm  

I believe if motion does present problems we simple introduce different kinds of motion. Jet, Yo-Yo, Orbit, Clear Out.

Then if the D does indeed think they can time it up....they will be right sometimes and in the neutral zone at other times.

The main reason for the first sound was the OLM were already in 2 point stances. So....the QB can sit under center for 10 seconds...1 second....5 seconds....and your OT never gets tired holding a stance.

Initially my concern was will 10 get off the ball fast enough going on first sound. I really haven't noticed that its ever been a problem. Maybe talk to your Group the next few weeks and ask them before they are all off to HS. Plenty have played our style in the Spring and another in the Fall so they would be a great barometer.

It would be interesting to get their take.

I had an idea to have a "false" motion, where we just send Z or H across the entire formation. Once he gets to his landmark, he just marks time until the snap. Snake Truck would be a perfect play for this.  That's only if it seems to be a problem.

When in doot . . . glass and oot.


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headtrip
(@headtrip)
Bronze
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 292
August 11, 2018 8:47 pm  

I won't get to look at the film until tomorrow evening, but we had our first full game with the no zone one back offense.

We won 13-6, but had a TD called back for a block in the back way downfield. Atleast they're blocking to the whistle, right?  Until I look at the film, I can't say for sure that we kept our sorta mega splits. The defense started bringing a ton of pressure up the middle after we gave them a steady diet of 23 and 24 all game, out of several different formations.  I would imagine they reduced the splits to deal with the blitz, but I didn't notice during the game and won't be sure until i see the film.

I have to say, the offense looks promising.


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