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Tripwire
(@tripwire)
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Joined: 10 years ago
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If it's legal, then isn't it now the right thing?

--Dave

No.  Just because something is legal doesn't make it the right thing.  Not for me anyway.  I would rather play the kids that busted their ass all season long and lose than to bring in some "studs" at playoff time and tell my kids that have been there all year to sit the bench.  But thats just me.

Hard work beats talent when talent doesn't work hard.


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CoachDP
(@coachdp)
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No.  Just because something is legal doesn't make it the right thing.  Not for me anyway.  I would rather play the kids that busted their ass all season long and lose than to bring in some "studs" at playoff time and tell my kids that have been there all year to sit the bench.  But thats just me.

Okay, I get what you mean.

--Dave

"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

The Mission Statement: "I want to show any young man that he is far tougher than he thinks, that he can accomplish more than what he dreamed and that his work ethic will take him wherever he wants to go."

#BattleReady newhope


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CoachJR267
(@coachjoel)
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Guys. I just heard about this rule at our conference planning meeting. I don't think its going to have the impact everyone seems to think it will. Sure you can roster high school players in an inactive fashion, for us it would mostly be 9th graders. But you still have a roster limit of 35. You can't put 20 kids from the frosh team on your roster and have them inactive because then you won't have an eligible roster for your seasons play. Where I do see this coming into play is you could theoretically put 3 or 4 standout freshmen on your Midget or Unlimited team. They could have an impact. But their freshman or JV football season would have to be over by the first Monday in October in order to be added to a PW roster as an active, certified player.

To do what ought to be done but would not have been done unless I did it, I thought to be my duty.


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COACH JC
(@winged)
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Guys. I just heard about this rule at our conference planning meeting. I don't think its going to have the impact everyone seems to think it will. Sure you can roster high school players in an inactive fashion, for us it would mostly be 9th graders. But you still have a roster limit of 35. You can't put 20 kids from the frosh team on your roster and have them inactive because then you won't have an eligible roster for your seasons play. Where I do see this coming into play is you could theoretically put 3 or 4 standout freshmen on your Midget or Unlimited team. They could have an impact. But their freshman or JV football season would have to be over by the first Monday in October in order to be added to a PW roster as an active, certified player.

We've actually had a number of kids express interest in it already. Many of the studs are going to go play JV ball (only 1 frosh team in our county) and comeback and play midgets. Our program is going to offer a very discounted rate. Like $75-100

It's all about having fun.  But losing aint fun!


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Tripwire
(@tripwire)
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Topic starter  

We've actually had a number of kids express interest in it already. Many of the studs are going to go play JV ball (only 1 frosh team in our county) and comeback and play midgets. Our program is going to offer a very discounted rate. Like $75-100

We aren't even charging them until they play.  We are assigning them and rostering them and depending on if they are used or not used they will pay a certain amount.  We already have a BUNCH express interest as well.  We normally barely have enough Unlimited players to play like barely 16 and that is with a few playing up.  This is going to help us a ton.  We also had a long board talk about what we are going to do.  We are going to simply roster an amount to make us a comfortable team without having a possibility of forfeiting (last year we had 2 forfeits due to injuries and not enough players). 

Hard work beats talent when talent doesn't work hard.


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DL
 DL
(@daniel-lyons)
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We've actually had a number of kids express interest in it already. Many of the studs are going to go play JV ball (only 1 frosh team in our county) and comeback and play midgets. Our program is going to offer a very discounted rate. Like $75-100

It becomes the tale of two seasons.  The one pre high school season and the one post.

I would develop a policy pre season for this event.  So everybody knows the deal when the new kids come and it isn't a surprise. 


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COACH JC
(@winged)
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It becomes the tale of two seasons.  The one pre high school season and the one post.

I would develop a policy pre season for this event.  So everybody knows the deal when the new kids come and it isn't a surprise.

Ya, I coach JM, wont effect me very often (every once in a while we'll get a 13 y/o freshman).

Right now I'm trying to adjust to the new weight limits. Completely changes how we evaluate players. Currently have 20 O/L's set to play for us! Lol. Gonna be crazy. All the stud O/L's from last years PW team will now be considered small. Changes everything.

It's all about having fun.  But losing aint fun!


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DL
 DL
(@daniel-lyons)
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Ya, I coach JM, wont effect me very often (every once in a while we'll get a 13 y/o freshman).

Right now I'm trying to adjust to the new weight limits. Completely changes how we evaluate players. Currently have 20 O/L's set to play for us! Lol. Gonna be crazy. All the stud O/L's from last years PW team will now be considered small. Changes everything.

No surprise.    Under those rules 75%+ of my select team would have been older lighters last year and we would have been very good. 

Kind of silly though.    Supposed to be 10u and would have been nearly all 11 year olds. 

I would love to get rid of OL rule for all leagues. 

I would entertain a case by case exception rule for heavy kids and light kids.    Where super huge kids have play up an age level by rule. 

But where a coach comes to a league in good faith and says this kid is big, but he can't play with older kids because he is just obese and not very good.   

And where a coach can say this kid is tiny and lacks athletic ability to compete with kids his own age. 

There is no reason for fat kids to play up and thin or small studs to play down.  But that happens all the time. 

Maybe an objective league official could go and look at kid if need be.      Trusted coaches get a pass.  Coaches who violate trust no longer get to ask or perhaps face suspension. 

Just spitballing. 


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COACH JC
(@winged)
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No surprise.    Under those rules 75%+ of my select team would have been older lighters last year and we would have been very good. 

Kind of silly though.    Supposed to be 10u and would have been nearly all 11 year olds. 

I would love to get rid of OL rule for all leagues. 

I would entertain a case by case exception rule for heavy kids and light kids.    Where super huge kids have play up an age level by rule. 

But where a coach comes to a league in good faith and says this kid is big, but he can't play with older kids because he is just obese and not very good.   

And where a coach can say this kid is tiny and lacks athletic ability to compete with kids his own age. 

There is no reason for fat kids to play up and thin or small studs to play down.  But that happens all the time. 

Maybe an objective league official could go and look at kid if need be.      Trusted coaches get a pass.  Coaches who violate trust no longer get to ask or perhaps face suspension. 

Just spitballing.

I cant even imagine what it would look like w/ out O/L's. Our skill players are almost always O/L's. Would be a much different game for us, thats for sure.

It's all about having fun.  But losing aint fun!


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mahonz
(@mahonz)
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Isn't there a movement to just go unlimited?

We had a multi team scrimmage yesterday and was talking to one of their coaches about this. He coached his older boy in PW....his youngest....had they still played under the PW format would be ineligible to play at all because he doesn't fit the matrix.

The Org he coaches in left PW about 4 years ago and joined our League.

What is beautiful, lives forever.


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jrk5150
(@jrk5150)
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Pop Warner has put a lot of perception effort into the weight matrix making play safer. It would require a huge about face to go all unlimited.  Not saying they couldn't do it, but it would be extremely hypocritical of them to do that.  Of course, not sure that would concern them...

Many on our board think we would lose a ton of kids if we got rid of the weight limits. Irrational parents.  And in today's legal climate, with all the concussion stuff out there, and the nature of football, we would need to be very careful how we tried to de-program them.

The more I look at our conference's D3 proposal the more I like it. 35 lbs seems a better gap for O/L than 20 lbs. And honestly, I can't really think of an O/L we've had under 80 lbs that was any kind of real difference maker. Yes, they will be much better players at the lower level than if they went up, but I don't think it swings the competitive balance, and in fact is probably a better level for the kid to play. We had 4 10's last year that were at or under 70 lbs who would likely be under that 80 lb weight.  Two of them would be really good players for us, but not dominant.  The other two will be good players. Even looking at the 3 kids that were 72-76 lbs last year, two of them would be dominant, the other would be a good player.

I like that 80 lb 11 year old limit for Jr. Pee Wee, to go with the 115 lb limit for 8-10's.  Feels MUCH better than even the 85 lb limit from last year.


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PSLCOACHROB
(@pslcoachrob)
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Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 12408
 

With our conference going unlimited it won't be that big of a deal for us due to the age cut off. That is the best way to combat this rule. I can't imagine what this will do for the Miami midget teams. They are already stacked now that they can add hs players who knows how good they will be. Same with teams from Baltimore, Los Angelas, Philly, all the big cities with a strong PW presence.


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mahonz
(@mahonz)
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Joined: 12 years ago
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Pop Warner has put a lot of perception effort into the weight matrix making play safer. It would require a huge about face to go all unlimited.  Not saying they couldn't do it, but it would be extremely hypocritical of them to do that.  Of course, not sure that would concern them...

Many on our board think we would lose a ton of kids if we got rid of the weight limits. Irrational parents.  And in today's legal climate, with all the concussion stuff out there, and the nature of football, we would need to be very careful how we tried to de-program them.

The more I look at our conference's D3 proposal the more I like it. 35 lbs seems a better gap for O/L than 20 lbs. And honestly, I can't really think of an O/L we've had under 80 lbs that was any kind of real difference maker. Yes, they will be much better players at the lower level than if they went up, but I don't think it swings the competitive balance, and in fact is probably a better level for the kid to play. We had 4 10's last year that were at or under 70 lbs who would likely be under that 80 lb weight.  Two of them would be really good players for us, but not dominant.  The other two will be good players. Even looking at the 3 kids that were 72-76 lbs last year, two of them would be dominant, the other would be a good player.

I like that 80 lb 11 year old limit for Jr. Pee Wee, to go with the 115 lb limit for 8-10's.  Feels MUCH better than even the 85 lb limit from last year.

J

Wowzers. I didn't understand a single sentence you just typed. Sounds like PW needs to take a long bowel movement before an unlimited weight movement.

What is beautiful, lives forever.


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CoachDP
(@coachdp)
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My understanding is even if new players are added to the roster after their school season is finished, they still have to meet the WEEK 1 weight requirement.  The weight has not moved up each week for them.  Of course, this would have no effect on the Unlimited division.

--Dave

"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

The Mission Statement: "I want to show any young man that he is far tougher than he thinks, that he can accomplish more than what he dreamed and that his work ethic will take him wherever he wants to go."

#BattleReady newhope


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Tripwire
(@tripwire)
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Joined: 10 years ago
Posts: 1478
Topic starter  

My understanding is even if new players are added to the roster after their school season is finished, they still have to meet the WEEK 1 weight requirement.  The weight has not moved up each week for them.  Of course, this would have no effect on the Unlimited division.

--Dave

I heard the opposite, we are checking.  I heard that as long as they are assigned to the roster at the start they do not have to meet any weight requirements until the time they play and then at the current weight limits.  So there is obviously some conflicting information.  Our league is checking into it as well.

Hard work beats talent when talent doesn't work hard.


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