We won our first ga...
 
Notifications
Clear all

We won our first game!

Page 5 / 6

Bob Goodman
(@bob-goodman)
Diamond
Joined: 10 years ago
Posts: 9601
 

You really don't understand how it all works.  Exhibition games?  No, you played for the league title (the regular season title).  Amd you played to get the top seed in the conference title playoffs.

But do they actually treat it that way at the awards ceremony?  Separate recognition for the round robin winner and the knockout winner?  Or do teams tend to sandbag the season as long as they're all going into playoffs?

In the present case, presumably #1 & #2 from the season skip the 1st round, while #3 plays #6 and #4 plays #5.  If you're not in the top 2, I don't see that it makes any difference whether you finished 3rd or 6th in terms of seed advantage.

Does #1 get to play an exhibition against #2 in the meantime?  If not, what kind of reward is it to have to sit while the other kids get to play?

And you play those to advance to the regional title bracket. And you play those to advance to the national title bracket.

Well of course there playoffs make sense, as I've written here previously.  It makes sense for champions to play against other champions in eliminations because anything else would be impracticable.  But which champion advances to those playoffs: the season champion, or the knockout champion?  If it's the knockout champion, then you're devaluing the season championship.

I feel sorry for players that have never had a chance to compete for a real championship.  Where at the minimum you have to make it through a regular season and a post season.

So if you played 10 games and came out with a better record than the other 5 teams doing the same, that's not a "real" championship?

OK, let's say you have teams playing off instead.  I feel sorry for those who played only 1 game for the championship, when a real championship would be best 2 out of 3 -- or maybe 3 of 5.  You could carry it on forever, and I don't see any particular reason to draw the line where you want to draw it.


ReplyQuote
Bob Goodman
(@bob-goodman)
Diamond
Joined: 10 years ago
Posts: 9601
 

We won the Championship last season as the 5th seed....knocking two undefeated teams out along the way and beating another that beat us in the regular season.  Playoffs can provide some nice revenge as well.

So is playing the same team again in round robin.  And it's on the schedule, not something you luck into.

Mismatches are not deliberately set. It is what it is per the Regular Season.

If you deliberately seed the high finishing teams against the low finishing ones, yes, you're deliberately setting mismatches.

You should contact some of the other house leagues around your area and create a bigger League. You'd be amazed at the end result...for everyone. Its fun....nothing more.

Everybody would like to have more teams.  But as to interleague play, it's hard to even agree on player eligibility rules.  Different weights, birthdays, calendars....

We are having all star games this year against an outside team.  It's going to be serious -- they're picking the players early and got us the field to practice on Sundays, starting this Sun.  Yes, this will be more fun than the usual.

The Warrior club used to field travel teams, but got away from that mode of operation years before I came into it.  This season our division's an example of how competitive it can get -- better than travel ass'ns I coached in previously.  Sure it'd be great to send our division (class) champions into playoffs, but it'd be hard to enter them in December.


ReplyQuote
mahonz
(@mahonz)
Kryptonite
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 23130
 

Everybody would like to have more teams.  But as to interleague play, it's hard to even agree on player eligibility rules.  Different weights, birthdays, calendars....

We are having all star games this year against an outside team.  It's going to be serious -- they're picking the players early and got us the field to practice on Sundays, starting this Sun.  Yes, this will be more fun than the usual.

The Warrior club used to field travel teams, but got away from that mode of operation years before I came into it.  This season our division's an example of how competitive it can get -- better than travel ass'ns I coached in previously.  Sure it'd be great to send our division (class) champions into playoffs, but it'd be hard to enter them in December.

Bob

Maybe the All Star game is that stepping stone?

Can you start in mid July and be totally done by Halloween. Seems if a couple of people from these Org got together and did some brainstorming....who knows?

What is beautiful, lives forever.


ReplyQuote
Bob Goodman
(@bob-goodman)
Diamond
Joined: 10 years ago
Posts: 9601
 

Maybe the All Star game is that stepping stone?

Conceivably.  Chief Jay is treating coaching in it as his swan song.  He's been with them in some capacity since they began operating in 1952, and the other admins. are old too, and we really need new blood there.  The current administration is great, but they can't go on forever.  (And they're involved in Little League too.)

Can you start in mid July and be totally done by Halloween.

Too many still playing baseball in mid July.  As it is, we've been having a lot of late registr'n.  The travel clubs do start earlier, and some have spring practice and/or clinics, but we get the multi-sport kids rather than those who want to commit to football as their sole outdoor sport.  We have some kids miss some football practices for organized basketball.  Lacrosse, soccer, swimming....

Seems if a couple of people from these Org got together and did some brainstorming....who knows?

Gee, we might invent travel ball!  😉  But seriously, there are reasons for these niches.  As has been noted, it's hard keeping kiddie football teams in oper'n for long around here.  The Ravens haven't had a Pop Warner circuit to play in for a while, I gather.  I coached with a Big Apple YFL affiliate ass'n in 2007, so it's not like there's no travel ball around here, but the Rebels that I coached with in 2008 got to Oct. before playing any PeeWee games.

I'd rather concentrate on smaller steps -- like being able to get uniform orders filled faster so we don't have to leave even late registrants in the lurch as occurred this year.  We could've had a couple more teams if the coaches were there and this uniform problem were hammered out.  If I'm still living here in the fall of 2014, I'd like to help with admin. if I can work on such things.


ReplyQuote
COACH JC
(@winged)
Diamond
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 6999
 

But do they actually treat it that way at the awards ceremony?  Separate recognition for the round robin winner and the knockout winner?  Or do teams tend to sandbag the season as long as they're all going into playoffs?

In the present case, presumably #1 & #2 from the season skip the 1st round, while #3 plays #6 and #4 plays #5.  If you're not in the top 2, I don't see that it makes any difference whether you finished 3rd or 6th in terms of seed advantage.

Does #1 get to play an exhibition against #2 in the meantime?  If not, what kind of reward is it to have to sit while the other kids get to play?
Well of course there playoffs make sense, as I've written here previously.  It makes sense for champions to play against other champions in eliminations because anything else would be impracticable.  But which champion advances to those playoffs: the season champion, or the knockout champion?  If it's the knockout champion, then you're devaluing the season championship.
So if you played 10 games and came out with a better record than the other 5 teams doing the same, that's not a "real" championship?

OK, let's say you have teams playing off instead.  I feel sorry for those who played only 1 game for the championship, when a real championship would be best 2 out of 3 -- or maybe 3 of 5.  You could carry it on forever, and I don't see any particular reason to draw the line where you want to draw it.

Yes, the league champion is acknowledged w/ a Patch.  Conference champ a big shiny trophy and so on.

I've never seen teams sandbag during the season. 

What advantage does the bye get???  Jeez Bob, now i'm really convinced you have no clue about football. 
1:  You don't have to risk being eliminated!
2:  You get to rest up and heal.  Everyone is banged up at the end of the year.
3:  You get to go scout your next opponent in person
4:  You can spend an extra week adding wrinkles, while the other teams have to gameplan for the team their playing.

Thera this thing in football called strategy.  Most of us coaches like to use it.  A bye week is a great time to expand on your strategy.

It's all about having fun.  But losing aint fun!


ReplyQuote
COACH JC
(@winged)
Diamond
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 6999
 

If you have a losing record, you don't deserve to be champion.  Is that hard to fathom?

The champion is whoever wins most consistently.  If you have 6 teams, the best way to determine that is for everybody to play everybody else twice.  You get a more clear & consistent picture that way than any other.  Knockouts you could do 5 times and get different results; in round robin the cream rises to the top pretty reliably.

Why do you think having a chance to knock somebody out in 1 game gives you a better idea of who deserves to be champion?  Since ther results are so irreproducible, I guess you must conclude that most of the time, nobody deserves to be champion, because unless there was just one dominant team, it would be different teams getting knocked out every time you repeated the tournament.

How would you tell if a die was fair or loaded?  You'd roll it a lot of times and see how often the faces came up.  You wouldn't play it off against other dice.

Why wouldn't you deserve to be a champion?  You don't have a losing record.  If you win the championship in a playoff bracket, that means you went UNDEFEATED in the POST SEASON.  The other team went undefeated in the REGULAR SEASON.  They were the champs of that season, the other team was the champs of the following season.  Pretty simple.

We always tell our kids that we play 2 seasons and we try to win both of em.  When the first one is done, we remind the kids that we are now 0-0 again.  Our new season has started and in this season we need to go undefeated to win it.  Amazingly, the kids grasp this concept very well.  Wish the same could be said for all of us.

Only you would compare football to rolling dice Bob.  Best of luck to you and the Navajos.

It's all about having fun.  But losing aint fun!


ReplyQuote
Bob Goodman
(@bob-goodman)
Diamond
Joined: 10 years ago
Posts: 9601
 

I've never seen teams sandbag during the season.

Yet there are now 2 threads about such a situation, where teams held out players during the season or had MPPs in only to yank them in the playoffs.

What advantage does the bye get???  Jeez Bob, now i'm really convinced you have no clue about football. 
1:  You don't have to risk being eliminated!

Jeez, why not just not play at all and never risk losing?

If you lose your 1st playoff game, what difference does it make whether it's in the 1st or 2nd round?  The only advantage would be if you were playing for stakes based on standing after the tournament.  However, if you get a 1st round bye, that means you play a maximum of 2 games, while teams that don't could possibly get a 3rd game.  The only way around this would be if they allowed the 2 bye teams to play each other in a non-elimination game, but I don't know if their league thought of that.

2:  You get to rest up and heal.  Everyone is banged up at the end of the year.

And you sit and get cold.  In my league everybody's apprehensive about the game after their bye week.

3:  You get to go scout your next opponent in person

But you've already played them once or possibly twice.

4:  You can spend an extra week adding wrinkles, while the other teams have to gameplan for the team their playing.

And they get to test their wrinkles vs. live opposition.


ReplyQuote
COACH JC
(@winged)
Diamond
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 6999
 

Yet there are now 2 threads about such a situation, where teams held out players during the season or had MPPs in only to yank them in the playoffs.Jeez, why not just not play at all and never risk losing?

If you lose your 1st playoff game, what difference does it make whether it's in the 1st or 2nd round?  The only advantage would be if you were playing for stakes based on standing after the tournament.  However, if you get a 1st round bye, that means you play a maximum of 2 games, while teams that don't could possibly get a 3rd game.  The only way around this would be if they allowed the 2 bye teams to play each other in a non-elimination game, but I don't know if their league thought of that.And you sit and get cold.  In my league everybody's apprehensive about the game after their bye week.But you've already played them once or possibly twice.And they get to test their wrinkles vs. live opposition.

Further examples that you have very little if any sense of gamesmanship or strategy?

I have a STRONG suspicion your one of those coaches that doesn't scout at all.  No coach worth a hill of beans would think that a 3rd scout tape in the playoffs isn't worth much.  You obviously don't put much thought into defending your opponents and making adjustments on both sides of the ball.  The last team i played, we had FIVE game tapes on them.  FIVE!  They had mercy ruled every opponent and had not punted a single time ALL SEASON.  We held them to NEGATIVE yards in the first half, and their only TD came when my SS forgot to go out on the field.  Why were we so successful against them?  Because our staff and our players new their offense inside and out.  We knew every wrinkle and every play they had because we had seen almost every snap they had taken all season.  THIS IS CALLED STRATEGY BOB, AND IT'S GOING ABOVE AND BEYOND, OUTWORKING YOUR OPPONENT AND LEAVING NOTHING TO CHANCE.  Take your pen and paper out and you might actually learn something here.

"They get to test their wrinkles VS live opposition".... So what?  I get to see their wrinkles and will be ready for it.  They don't get to see mine.  And if your a good coach w/ a good system, your not adding wrinkles that you THINK MIGHT WORK.  I know our wrinkles will work.  Because we know our system and understand how defenses react to different things.  ONCE AGAIN BOB, THIS IS CALLED STRATEGY. 

"In my league everyone is apprehensive about the game after a bye week".... Well then you guys practice like pussy's and don't know how to prepare your team.  If you team loses steam or aggression during a bye week, that is 100% YOUR FAULT.  I hear crap like this all the time.  "Oh, our kids didn't show up to play".  No!  You didn't show up to coach, and your players responded to it.  If your players lack desire, motivation and or effort, that is a coaching problem, not a player problem.  If my team loses this year, which is entirely possible, i can promise you it wont be because they didn't play hard.

The only reason i even respond to your nonsense Bob, is in the hopes that other newer coaches, that fall into the victim attitude, might read this and learn from it.  I know theres no hope for you.  Your too stuck in your  ways, in spite of the fact that your results don't back it up.

It's all about having fun.  But losing aint fun!


ReplyQuote
CoachDP
(@coachdp)
Kryptonite
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 17794
 

their only TD came when my SS forgot to go out on the field.

--Jake, maybe you forgot to remind him.

If my team loses this year, which is entirely possible, i can promise you it wont be because they didn't play hard.

--But it could be because your Safety forgot to go out on the field.

--Just giving you a hard time, Jake.  Anyhoos, your diatribe is lost on Bob.  He's out in space somewhere.  But hopefully your post will do someone else some good.

--Dave

"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

The Mission Statement: "I want to show any young man that he is far tougher than he thinks, that he can accomplish more than what he dreamed and that his work ethic will take him wherever he wants to go."

#BattleReady newhope


ReplyQuote
COACH JC
(@winged)
Diamond
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 6999
 

Lol.  I definitely will make sure from now on.  It was a 14-0 game early in the 4th quarter.  Our starters were staying in the game for the duration on defense unless we scored again. 

I talked to him about it at practice.  He said he just had a massive brain fart.  He got subbed out on offense, we punted the ball (he was on punt team).  Then he just completely spaced going out on D. 

I think i was talking to our OC about what happened on the last play before the punt (they had blitzed our jet sweep) and what adjustment we would make.  Once i turned my focus back to defense, it was too late for me to notice we had 10 men on the field.  I never noticed it until i watched the game film.  It was one of the first things i went and looked at.  I just couldn't understand how they had hit such a big run when we had shut down their run game all night.

The same kid fumbled on a buck sweep, and muffed a punt return.  He was pretty down on himself, but i reminded him how great he did the rest of the game and he'll get another chance soon to play his best game.

It's all about having fun.  But losing aint fun!


ReplyQuote
DL
 DL
(@daniel-lyons)
Platinum
Joined: 10 years ago
Posts: 4984
 

Gotta love that Bob never gets mad and never leaves even though so many give him a hard time.


ReplyQuote
Coach_O
(@rob_coach_o)
Gold
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 2233
 

Gotta love that Bob never gets mad and never leaves even though so many give him a hard time.

Bobs a good dude, he just has his own perspective which is for the most part different that most of the coaches on here.

Helmet Decals
http://Facebook.com/SportsLiveDecals


ReplyQuote
mahonz
(@mahonz)
Kryptonite
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 23130
 

Gotta love that Bob never gets mad and never leaves even though so many give him a hard time.

He reminds me of Professor Fink...and yes I have mentioned that to Bob before.  🙂

What is beautiful, lives forever.


ReplyQuote
COACH JC
(@winged)
Diamond
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 6999
 

Gotta love that Bob never gets mad and never leaves even though so many give him a hard time.

I've tried w/ Bob.  He just is unwilling to look at anything he does and adjust the way he thinks about or does things. 

Saying thing like a 3rd game film of a playoff game is unimportant, is not just having a different view point.  It's just down right uniformed & poor coaching.

It's all about having fun.  But losing aint fun!


ReplyQuote
GP
 GP
(@gpenn44)
Gold
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 1670
 

Or PW mandates that we stay in a hotel right next to a "Gentleman's Club."

likely story... 😀

"Motivation is simple. You eliminate those who are not motivated." - Lou Holtz


ReplyQuote
Page 5 / 6
Share: